SPLIT THREAD: Zen & Catholicism

[Hans]

Hello Jeffrey,

it's all okay if we can take a deep breath once in a while and just acknowledge that communication itself is a very tough business.

One person refers to religion and relates it to lots of structural and historical facts, others to their own life awareness shaped by certain wonderful individuals that belonged to a tradition, others again just mix and match to their heart's content and are too busy trying to be a good person to stop and wonder too much about definitions.

Where I personally totally agree is that these days our individualist culture has led to the erosion of useful definitions.

I am luckily in no position to tell anyone when they start/stop being a Catholic/Jew etc., but as a matter of personal opinion I am also a bit sad that basically Catholic/Buddhist can mean just about anything these days.

However, in terms of Zen practise all those labels are just useful bullshit anyhow. Look at people walking their walk, not how they talk their talk


Gassho,


Hans Chudo Mongen

[hamlin81]

I've personally had to wrestle some with reinterpreting Christianity so it can have meaning for me. I don't live in an area that has any Mahayana Buddhist centers, so I have to go to Christian Churches in order to have a spiritual community.

Some things that have helped me is to re-imagine God as something more abstract. I've found a lot of teachers make comparisons of God with the Dharmakaya. I've even reframed God as Amitabha Buddha. Obviously, the "Creator God" part doesn't work, if you do this, but I don't mind just dropping that belief. I can also easily see Jesus as a Bodhisattva.

I go to an Episcopal Church, not a Catholic one. I'm thankful that in the Episcopal Church no one really bats an eye if you have to reframe things like this.

For me personally, I mainly only look to the Gospels. I don't pay much attention to the rest of the bible.

[Robaato]

I partially agree and disagree, Daitetsu. On the one hand side, Catholicism seems to force you to believe things while Zen (on the other hand side) wants you to check things yourself. (At least in my humble understanding.)

There was a famous German Zen master called Hugo Enomyia-Lassalle who also was a member of a Catholic order. I believe he practice Zen at Hosshinji monastery in Japan. This can kind of prove that Catholicism and Zen can go hand in hand.

Here's a free book by Kurosaki Kokichi about the origins of Christian sects. And in the book you're also told about what originally Christianity was in the beginning. Having practiced Buddhist meditation for a while, some passages sound very familiar to me.

[Kyousui]

Kevin Hunt Trappist and Zen teacher

Father Kevin Hunt, Trappist, and a transmitted Zen teacher "tells me a story about St. Theresa of Avila. When she was a little girl, someone asked her what she wanted in life. She told them, “I want to see God.” “That’s all I’ve ever wanted to do,” Kevin tells me, “and Zen has provided the best way for me to do it.”.

https://rickmdaniel.blogspot.com/2014/05/528-father-kevin-hunt.html

[JohnS]

As a former Catholic and seminarians back when, I agree with you

Gassho

John

SatTodayLAH

[JohnS]

Leaving things as they are includes no judgement.

[Jundo]

As a former Catholic and seminarians back when, I agree with you

Gassho

John

SatTodayLAH

Agree with whom? We have comments here since 2013, you need to help me out!

Gassho, J

Stlah

[Shonin Risa Bear]

Big fan of Merton's Seven Storey Mountain; also big fan of Merton's Zen and the Birds of Appetite. I used to read his paraphrases of Chuang Tze and go out and sit under the trees, stunned.

The birds flitted from branch to branch and picked bugs.

gassho
two-face sat/lah

[JohnS]

the original post

[Jundo]

As a former Catholic and seminarians back when, I agree with you

the original post

Well, as the discussion made more than clear, that depends on the person, how it is done, how wide the heart, how boundless the space there, and how doctrines are interpreted. There are many Catholic Zen folks, included quite a few excellent Priest-Roshi.

Gassho, Jundo

STLah

[Rich]

This is the only place where i can read what i said 9 years ago

Cool

Sat/lah


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[Meian]

Well, as the discussion made more than clear, that depends on the person, how it is done, how wide the heart, how boundless the space there, and how doctrines are interpreted. There are many Catholic Zen folks, included quite a few excellent Priest-Roshi.

Gassho, Jundo

STLah

Gassho2 meian stlh

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[Zenkon]

A thought

Straddle
Too wide a river,
And both feet
Get wet

Gassho

Zenkon
sat/lah

[Geika]

A thought

Straddle
Too wide a river,
And both feet
Get wet

Gassho

Zenkon
sat/lah

I like that.

Gassho
Sat, lah

[Shokai]

There's a scene in "on Golden Pond" that depicts this poem Perfectly.

gassho, Shokai
stlah