Zazen for Beginners Series: THREAD for QUESTIONS, COMMENTS

[Anka]

Hi Jundo,

Thank you for those fantastic points.

Reality really is an interesting subject because in truth we have no idea if we are experiencing life as it truly is or if our minds warp the true sense data.

All decisions can be seen as both wise/warm and ignorant/cold based off the past experiences and mindset of the person analysing the decision.

Sat Today
James F

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[Jundo]

Hi Georgina,

In my understanding of mirror mind, it's that place inside your zazen when you are just part of life, without thoughts governing you and you just flow with what is. Yes, it's a peace that transcends it all. It's a wholeness that melts you with the universe. It's where you just reflect life without opinions and judgment. It lasts just an instant but we don't get lost in it. It's what is.

And about gassho, it's pretty much like namasté in yoga. It's a greeting, a reverence, a salute, a symbol of union, peace and wish that all boundaries are lost. To me (can't talk for anyone else) is a sacred mudra (hand posture) that reminds me that we are one.

Gassho,

Kyonin
SatToday

What Kyonin said.

Gassho, palms together, two hands coming together as one.

I believe that mirror mind often brings to heart "peace that transcends all understanding" that's "there all along, but somehow it's not so easy to tap into." Yes. I simply remind folks to remember that the "clarity of the mirror" in our Shikantaza way is present seen or unseen, even if the mirror is completely obscured by the dusts of our human excess desires, anger and divided thinking, judgments and runaway emotions.

It is vital that we do not always demand to "feel peaceful" in this Way, and learn to trust in the "Peace and Clarity" that is present both when feeling peaceful and clear --and-- even when feeling upset or confused, as humans sometimes do. It is hard to explain, but it is something like the Sun which shines even when the skies are clear, open and boundless, and even on the cloudiest or stormiest days (still shining seen or not, clouds or no clouds). We learn to trust, and subtly sense, that the sun and clear boundlessness are yet present even when we are feeling obscured by the darkest clouds. We learn not to become lost in the clouds, and perhaps can find the light which illuminates even the clouds. Don't always demand clear skies!

Hi Anka,

The explanation of mirror mind that I have heard and trust from experience is as follows.

When something happens (a noise, a taste, a feeling) our minds have been trained to instantly apply either "I like" or "I dislike". These notions effect how we experience the feelings or thoughts. Mirror mind generated from our practice allows us to experience what our senses are picking up without bias of like or dislike. As a result we see, hear, and feel what is truly there. As a result our judgement is not clouded and we can act according to these stimulants from a base of understanding and compassion.

Sat today

(Is Anka your name? Would you mind to sign a human name to your posts? Helps us keep things human around here. )

Some Buddhist Teachers do say such things, but I do not believe it is quite so simple that "we see, hear, and feel what is truly there. As a result our judgement is not clouded and we can act according to these stimulants from a base of understanding and compassion." First, I believe that the processing of sense data by the human mind is so complicated, and so "reprocessed" to create the world we experience in the mind, that I hesitate to use the phrase "what is truly there." (If you were seeing truly unprocessed sense data, it might appear as completely uninterpreted blotches and unintelligible noise, for example, much like a newborn baby might experience. I don't believe that we are trying to experience that). Let us just say that what we experience is life less burdened and imprisoned by judgments and reactions to what appears in life.

Also, I am not a Buddhist teacher that believes that the result of "mirror mind" necessarily means that we will act with Wisdom and Compassion. Frankly, I believe that a sociopath who acts without empathy for the emotions and humanity of others might also be operating from a kind of cool "mirror mind" free of judgement. Certainly, I do not believe that experiencing the clarity and freedom of "mirror mind" will necessarily mean that our actions from there will always be wise and warm. We have to be sure to nurture Wisdom and Compassion in our Practice, through learning to live in such way, so that such is an aspect of "mirror mind" and all the rest of our Practice. The Precepts help us here.

Gassho, Jundo

SatToday

[Anka]

The explanation of mirror mind that I have heard and trust from experience is as follows.

When something happens (a noise, a taste, a feeling) our minds have been trained to instantly apply either "I like" or "I dislike". These notions effect how we experience the feelings or thoughts. Mirror mind generated from our practice allows us to experience what our senses are picking up without bias of like or dislike. As a result we see, hear, and feel what is truly there. As a result our judgement is not clouded and we can act according to these stimulants from a base of understanding and compassion.

Sat today

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[RobotUnicorn]

Thank you for your explanations, Kyonini I hope I can learn to be in that mode a little more often!

Gassho,
Georgina

SatToday

[Kyonin]

Hi Georgina,

In my understanding of mirror mind, it's that place inside your zazen when you are just part of life, without thoughts governing you and you just flow with what is. Yes, it's a peace that transcends it all. It's a wholeness that melts you with the universe. It's where you just reflect life without opinions and judgment. It lasts just an instant but we don't get lost in it. It's what is.

And about gassho, it's pretty much like namasté in yoga. It's a greeting, a reverence, a salute, a symbol of union, peace and wish that all boundaries are lost. To me (can't talk for anyone else) is a sacred mudra (hand posture) that reminds me that we are one.

Gassho,

Kyonin
SatToday

[RobotUnicorn]

Thank you, Jundo, these are great talks and I'm finding them really useful.

I've just finished listening to talk number 10 about mirror mind. Sometimes when I sit, I feel a deep sense of calm and 'rightness' with where I am - it's hard to describe, but I refer to it as (using a Christian reference) "the peace that transcends all understanding". Is this what mirror mind refers to?

In that moment, I 'know' it's there all along, but somehow it's not so easy to tap into in other moments!

Georgina
SatToday

(PS. What does Gassho mean, please?)

[PClark1]

It does help, very much. Thank you both for your input.

Gassho,

Paul

Sat today

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In the Burmese pose, does it matter which leg is folded under first? I usually see folks with their left leg under and their right toward the outside, but I have a lot if hip pain when I try to sit that way. (Old hip injury) however, if I do the opposite, I'm usually quite comfortable.

I was just wondering if there was a traditional reason to have the left leg under and should I look for a different pose if I'm not able to adapt to that?

Gassho,
Paul

Sat today

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Hello Paul,

I also agree that you should do what is best for your body type or injuries. Zazen is not suppose to be torture or cause undo pain and discomfort. There are times when we challenge ourselves and sit with some discomfort (like in sesshin or longer sittings), but this is only temporary. So listen to your body. Even if sitting in your normal position you need to shift, then gassho, shift, gassho, and continue with your sitting.

Hope this helps. =)

Gassho
Shingen

s@today

[Jishin]

Do what's comfortable.

My 2 cents.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_

[PClark1]

In the Burmese pose, does it matter which leg is folded under first? I usually see folks with their left leg under and their right toward the outside, but I have a lot if hip pain when I try to sit that way. (Old hip injury) however, if I do the opposite, I'm usually quite comfortable.

I was just wondering if there was a traditional reason to have the left leg under and should I look for a different pose if I'm not able to adapt to that?

Gassho,
Paul

Sat today

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[Jundo]

The settling period it allows, though, is useful. I use it to recite the precepts, say atonement, and read or chant the sutra I'm working on.
Gassho,
SatToday

When sitting Shikantaza, just sit Shikantaza.

Before or after Shikantaza is a time to chant. Of course, Shikantaza has no measure, no before or after. Yet, it does ... so please do not break Shikantaza at such short intervals for other activities.

Gassho, Jundo

SatToday

[Tom]

its hard SeaChel, that impatience, for me at least, has been an important part of practice. ("hello impatience my old friend, it's nice to talk to you again.") There's a timer out there that gongs every five minutes, or whatever intervals you want it to. But for me the five-minute interval just facilitated more impatience. http://www.onlinemeditationtimer.com/. The settling period it allows, though, is useful. I use it to recite the precepts, say atonement, and read or chant the sutra I'm working on.
Gassho,
SatToday

[PClark1]

I have been going through the new member video series and I have to say that Jundo's teaching method really resonates with me. The points are so concise and well presented. I'm only seven videos in and I already have noticed an improvement in my zazen from putting those teachings into practice.

Thank you, so very much for this video series.

Gassho,

Paul

Sat today

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[Michael Joseph]

Jundo,

I just want to let you know that I have really been enjoying the talks and the techniques that you use to illustrate them. More than once, I've cleaned my mind with a hammer or a blender. They work as well as a broom. Also, I owe you particular thanks for the talk on cross-legged sitting. I have been having trouble with the legs (like you, I'm 50-something and not thin and limber--thimber, if you will), but I have been trying out different positions. Fortunately, you've reassured me that sitting is the point; whatever the position, I just make sure that I have no "loose ends."

Gassho,
Michael J.
SatToday

[Makkusu]

Hi Max,

As to legs falling asleep, this is usually pressure on the sciatic nerve, which can be alleviated by shifting the weight off that spot, and also sitting on the Zafu correctly so that it does not pinch the spot. It still happens to anyone sometimes, but have a look here:

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?13209-Pins-and-Needles&p=148838&viewfull=1#post148838

Gassho, J

SatToday

Hey,

I fixed the leg problem now. I don't know how, but by spreading my legs slightly farther apart, they don't fall asleep. Or my body got used to it. Anyway, now that I sit pretty solid for 15 minutes straight, my butt starts to fall asleep. A while ago, I read that one should kinda "sit on his tailbone", at least this seems to be the most solid way.

Gassho, Max
#sattoday