Informal Reading Group: REALIZING GENJOKOAN 2021 Edition Begins Week of 11 April 2021

[Nengei]

Domo, Tairin-san. That was a typo on my part, now corrected.

Gassho,
Nengei
Sat today. LAH.

[Tairin]

Domo, Tairin-san. That was a typo on my part, now corrected.

Gassho,
Nengei
Sat today. LAH.

[aprapti]

thank you Nengei.



aprapti


sat

[Meishin]

4. What is the self?

What do you see when you turn out the light?
I can't tell you, but I know it's mine.

Gassho
Meishin
STLah

[Onkai]

Thank you, Nengei. The questions required some reflection, and enhance the reading, which I'm enjoying.

1. The part about the different kanji that can be used for koan left me scratching my head. I kind of have to take his word for it that both could mean the same thing. I like the thought of the full word as combining public or "to equalize inequality" and individual "to keep one's lot." To me that is similar to saying "Self and other are not one, not two." It's something to ponder. If I think I've got it, it's slipped away, but with a questioning mind, facets of reality come into view.

2. I think Okumura answers the question of individual practice and public practice with the two simultaneous meanings of koan and his statements and question,

We are completely independent while at the same time we are fully a part of the community. So, how can we actualize both sides of our lives within one action? This is really the basic point of our lives.

3. I love the community practice with Treeleaf, but at the same time, I can’t escape the fact that my own practice is my own, as an individual, especially with an online community. For instance, when I first wrote this, I realized I hadn’t sat for two days as a result of reactions to my 2nd COVID vaccination. There are parameters to my individual practice within the community. I would also like to find ways to express thematically the two opposing ideas combined in my fiction. That eludes me right now.

4. I’ve thought of the self as what is contained in my body and mind, but I’m learning to see that what I am is shaped by environment and circumstances and that what I do changes what is around me, becoming an extension of me, in a way. I trust the idea that I am the universe expressing itself as me, and that I express the universe, but I only get glimpses of that.

5. If the two words don't express enlightenment, they must come close.

Gassho,
Onkai
Sat/lah

[Kiri]

2. Is my individual practice different from community practice? Should it be? How does Okumura answer this question?

Okumura roshi uses the example of the Tenzo. When the cook is in the kitchen preparing the meals, that's his practice and his responsibility alone. No other person can do it for him. And yet, his practice affects all other members of the community since meals are for people to consume. That way his practice becomes the community's practice.
As I see it, that's how it should be. My life is mine to live and no one can do the 'living' for me. But I am a social animal too. I live for others and others live for me. I am there to support people and I expect people to support me. I only wish I could see the more subtle ways of this truth. I feel one aspect of the self is hidden in it too. But then, that's why we practice zazen every day!

Gassho, Nikolas
Sat/Lah

[Doshin]

Okumura roshi uses the example of the Tenzo. When the cook is in the kitchen preparing the meals, that's his practice and his responsibility alone. No other person can do it for him. And yet, his practice affects all other members of the community since meals are for people to consume. That way his practice becomes the community's practice.
As I see it, that's how it should be. My life is mine to live and no one can do the 'living' for me. But I am a social animal too. I live for others and others live for me. I am there to support people and I expect people to support me. I only wish I could see the more subtle ways of this truth. I feel one aspect of the self is hidden in it too. But then, that's why we practice zazen every day!

Gassho, Nikolas
Sat/Lah

I like that Nikolas

Doshin
St

[JimInBC]

1. Okumura offers a few different interpretations of kōan, and focuses most of his discussion on this portion of the word Genjōkōan. He suggests that Dōgen's choice of kanji implies meaning. Still, I wonder whether there was an individual meaning that was Dōgen's intention, or whether the collective meanings of this word are important. Or, maybe none of that matters because the greater meaning comes from context. Thoughts?

While searching for Dogen's meaning is certainly one approach to a text, I'm not sure the fact an interpretation fits Dogen's meaning is ultimately the most important criteria. Interpretations are layered on the text by different commentators, and it seems that multi-layered approach creates both a poetic richness and many fingers pointing at the moon.

2. Is my individual practice different from community practice? Should it be? How does Okumura answer this question?

SN 47.19
Trans by Bhante Sujato
At one time the Buddha was staying in the land of the Sumbhas, near the town of the Sumbhas called Sedaka. There the Buddha addressed the mendicants:
“Once upon a time, mendicants, an acrobat set up his bamboo pole and said to his apprentice Medakathālikā, ‘Come now, dear Medakathālikā, climb up the bamboo pole and stand on my shoulders.’
‘Yes, teacher,’ she replied. She climbed up the bamboo pole and stood on her teacher’s shoulders.
Then the acrobat said to Medakathālikā, ‘You look after me, dear Medakathālikā, and I’ll look after you. That’s how, guarding and looking after each other, we’ll display our skill, collect our fee, and get down safely from the bamboo pole.’
When he said this, Medakathālikā said to her teacher, ‘That’s not how it is, teacher! You should look after yourself, and I’ll look after myself. That’s how, guarding and looking after ourselves, we’ll display our skill, collect our fee, and get down safely from the bamboo pole.’
That’s the way,” said the Buddha. “It’s just as Medakathālikā said to her teacher. Thinking ‘I’ll look after myself,’ you should cultivate mindfulness meditation. Thinking ‘I’ll look after others,’ you should cultivate mindfulness meditation. Looking after yourself, you look after others; and looking after others, you look after yourself.
And how do you look after others by looking after yourself? By development, cultivation, and practice of meditation. And how do you look after yourself by looking after others? By acceptance, harmlessness, love, and sympathy.
Thinking ‘I’ll look after myself,’ you should cultivate mindfulness meditation. Thinking ‘I’ll look after others,’ you should cultivate mindfulness meditation. Looking after yourself, you look after others; and looking after others, you look after yourself.”

3. What are our particular struggles with "put[ting] aside our uniqueness" and "find[ing] the middle way" as discussed by Okumura, in our time and in our Sangha?

Uniqueness has a dreary sameness. Toss it out with dirty dishwater, self, and other things that you are finished with.

4. What is the self?

What we threw out with uniqueness and dirty dishwater.

5. Is enlightenment within this one word?

Enlightenment is not found in words. Words are not found in enlightenment. But it's a devil of a challenge to give directions without words.

Gassho, Jim
ST/LaH

Sent from my SM-T510 using Tapatalk

[Risho]

1. Okumura offers a few different interpretations of kōan, and focuses most of his discussion on this portion of the word Genjōkōan. He suggests that Dōgen's choice of kanji implies meaning. Still, I wonder whether there was an individual meaning that was Dōgen's intention, or whether the collective meanings of this word are important. Or, maybe none of that matters because the greater meaning comes from context. Thoughts?

I think the various interpretations are important in highlighting what Dogen meant; of course, we'll never know for sure but I feel Okumura Roshi provides a very compelling case.

2. Is my individual practice different from community practice? Should it be? How does Okumura answer this question?

I don't think so; I like Jim's answer above. When we practice we aren't just practicing for ourselves. We must do the practice but it is not our own. When we truly practice zazen and try to live in accord with our precepts and bodhisattva vows, we automatically include everyone - not two; I know it sounds cliche but it's not. I was thinking about a daily gatha I started reciting during last ango when I make coffee, and it's a pattern I see in gathas in general. "Making morning coffee, I vow with all sentient beings..." or whatever it is, we vow with all sentient beings because we're all here together. I like Okumura's answer to this, we can't do whatever we want willy nilly. Although we can never fully uphold our vows, precepts or sit zazen properly, when we do try to do those things (by not separating from others) then we are doing them right even as we miss the mark and try again. So by necessity, all practice involves the sangha.

3. What are our particular struggles with "put[ting] aside our uniqueness" and "find[ing] the middle way" as discussed by Okumura, in our time and in our Sangha?

I would say if I don't understand something, I try not to just go along. I need to make sure I'm not giving up my responsibility in understanding the dharma by just agreeing; at the same time, I don't need to disrupt the sangha. It's a balance; old ego's die hard

4. What is the self?

The self can be viewed as our individual selves. It's real in a sense, but it's also something we create in our minds so we can make sense of the world. But it is only real in relationship to everything else; without anything to compare it against, it doesn't exist. So it is both real and not real in a way.

5. Is enlightenment within this one word?

Like any word or concept (including a "self") it's a pointer; it points to something, but it's much more than that and not contained within it or anything really. When you say a word, it has a definition, and definitions implicitly rely on comparison to explain the limits of what it is that is being defined. Without everything that it is not, it could not be said what it is. This is sort of related to the idea of a self. The idea of me, although I am here, only makes sense with relationship to everything else. I have no idea if that makes sense.

Gassho

Risho
-stlah

[Seikan]

Apologies for not commenting as of yet. Life has simply been a bit overwhelming as of late, but I am now caught up with the reading and ready to jump in.

The various interpretations of "Koan" posed by Okumura are fascinating, but I feel that they ask more questions of me than they answer. I want to sit with this one a bit longer. I suspect that Dogen did not have one, narrow meaning of the term in mind when he used it. With Dogen, there always seems to be multiple sides to his words/teachings, which is what makes them so wonderfully simple and rich at the same time.

Regarding individualism vs. collectivism, etc., I was floored by Okumura's hand analogy. I'm certain that I've heard/read that analogy before, but reading it again in this moment, it resonated far more deeply at this point in my practice. This is likely due to my having been spending more time as of late reading the Sandokai and considering the whole concept of the relative vs. the absolute. Okumura's hand analogy is a wonderful way to demonstrate how neither side of the coin is any "better" or any more "real" than they other. Reality is equally both (and neither) at the same time. I often simplify this to "not one, not two, both, and neither" (I definitely stole this from someone, but I can't recall where I may have seen it first).

Using that same lens, I consider the "self":

self = not one
Self (capital "s") = not two
self + Self = Self - self

To truly understand, perhaps we need to take the square root of self.

Thank you Nengei and all for the discussion so far. This is a wonderful opportunity to read and reflect with you all.

Gassho,
Seikan

-stlah-

[Risho]

Thank you Seikan - your post jogged something about the community part of practice. In a way, all of life truly is a practice. We have to constantly do things in the face of the unknown. From that perspective, as I type on my computer and look around my apartment, all of me is here now because of community (the universe); I forgot where I read this (it is certainly not my original thought), but if you pay close attention it's as if the universe has intentionally conspired to bring me to this moment as I am now. This practice constantly takes me back to Gratitude; this is such a miracle, there is no other way I can put it. I certainly do not deserve any of it, so all I can do is take care of my piece (or "keep my lot" from Senne's translation of koan).

One thing that I've noticed as a direct benefit of practice is that I sometimes feel this overwhelming sense of gratitude. I know I said it above, but practice has made me realize how miraculous it is that we are here at all. Just incredible.

So maybe it's not like intentionally practicing to help others (although helping others isn't a bad thing); because we are so interrelated by taking care of ourselves we take care of everyone so the universe can conspire to bless them as well.

Gassho

Risho
-stlah

[Inshin]

.1. Okumura offers a few different interpretations of kōan, and focuses most of his discussion on this portion of the word Genjōkōan. He suggests that Dōgen's choice of kanji implies meaning. Still, I wonder whether there was an individual meaning that was Dōgen's intention, or whether the collective meanings of this word are important. Or, maybe none of that matters because the greater meaning comes from context. Thoughts?

First of all : deep bows of gratitude and hats off to all involved in translating Shobogenzo to English. Apparently it is rare in this world to come across Dharma teachings, how more rare to be able to read Dogen. As someone who grew up speaking only Polish, I'm reminded of my great fortune of being able to learn other languages and read good translations of Ancestors' works.
Which brings me to a question : has Senne's and Kyogo's Gosho been translated into English or other languages? It would be a treasure.

. 2. Is my individual practice different from community practice? Should it be? How does Okumura answer this question?

Okumara's and Dogen's examples of individual and community practice is based on a Sangha that practices the same Dharma. Not only I don't have that experience but also I live in a mega city where the community is not as strong. I never really belonged anywhere, always felt like an outcast so here's the problem of uniquness and individuality. What I've noticed though is that my individual practice reflects on my immediate environment that has became more peaceful. Triggers, anger, stress that previously would have blown into something big, don't carry so much weight anymore and are easier to exstinguish before a spark becomes a flame. I also notice beauty in random people, where previously there often would be some sort of judgment. That little shift affects how I relate to others and I find those exchanges more valuable. Through my personal practice I am finding ways of how to be of service to others. Step by step, smile by smile.

.4. What is the self?

I only know what it's not.

. 5. Is enlightenment within this one word?

I think it's one of the best descriptions of enlightenment expressed in one word. Genjokoan. Not a particular state to achieve but an action, a practice that deepens with the realisation of Dharma, be it gradual or sudden. Expressing the absolute within and through the relative. Expressing timelessness through impermanence. A practice - enlightenment that seems impossible, yet we sit, chop the wood and carry the water.

Gassho
Sat

[Kevin M]

Thanks Nengei for your questions, they made me go back and clarify my understanding of this chapter.

Okumura's parsing of "genjokoan" provided a succinct shorthand of the meaning of both the term itself, and the work as a whole. I like that he opens the book this way, getting straight to the fundamental point of what Genjokoan is all about.

One surprise for me is that I tend to think of form and emptiness, relative and absolute, in slightly grandiose terms - almost like cosmology and metaphysics; but Okumura adds that these can also be seen at a very personal level, in how our actions affect not only ourselves but others.

4. I’ve thought of the self as what is contained in my body and mind, but I’m learning to see that what I am is shaped by environment and circumstances and that what I do changes what is around me, becoming an extension of me, in a way. I trust the idea that I am the universe expressing itself as me, and that I express the universe, but I only get glimpses of that.

I really liked Onkai's comment. I think maybe this is what is meant by "To study the Buddha Way is to study the self". That the "the self" extends out to encompass, and to be encompassed by, everyone and every thing. One of the most arresting parts of Genjokoan for me is the idea that enlightenment is not a mental state or an intellectual grasp of philosophical ideas, but rather a dynamic moment to moment living or manifesting of this middle way.

Gassho,
Kevin
Sat Today

[Tairin]

“Heart Sutra emptiness is considered to be absolute truth in which there is no separation between the things of this world. For living beings, there are no eyes, no ears, no nose, no tongue, no hand, no nothing because this reality is just functioning without any fixed entity; it is empty. And as living beings we are interconnected completely, living with all other beings; we are all one whole, all living the same life. In this way the whole universe is just one thing, as five fingers are just one hand. Yet, eyes are eyes, a nose is a nose, a tongue is a tongue, and this person, Shohaku Okumura

I don’t know how I missed this before. We chant The Heart Sutra regularly and we’ve studied it. I’ve struggled with the concept of “emptiness “ but now that I see emptiness as an expression of the absolute it suddenly all fell into place for me.

Like many people here Tenzo Kyokun is an important text I revisit regularly

In Tenzo-Kyōkun (Instructions for the Cook), for example, Dōgen said that as the cook of the community we have complete responsibility for the way we work, since our cooking is our own personal practice. Yet this personal practice is more than just a personal activity since it also has a function within the community.

I reflect on this as I go about my daily tasks.

Thank you all for your thoughts on this section. I really enjoy reading Okumura’s writing and your thoughts


Tairin
Sat today and lah

[Zenkon]

In Chap. 2, I was struck by how equality/universality and inequality/uniqueness were presented as complimentary versus conflicting, and how reality is really a combination of the two. I perceive the world through MY senses and therefore, see things as they relate to "me", the natural center of the universe. Yet, emptiness tells us that the "me" is only a construct of my mind, and dependent origination show how everything is connected. Seeing these seemingly opposing views as the Two Truths , and as simply different ways of looking at reality was a very powerful observation. It is definitely helping me to better understand the concept of "form is emptiness, emptiness is form" as a "merging of oneness and uniqueness". The hard part, for me, will be, as Dogen says "seeing the two sides as one action". I think the starting point here, again for me, is seeing my actions like the cook in the chapter - acting not only as an individual in preparing food, but also as a part of the community - namely, the middle way.

Gassho

Dick

Sat/lah