sitting zazen, timeless time

[Seishin]

Seishin-Do, I have a very simple answer: I'm done when I'm done.

Seriously, though....my body's "internal clock" seems to work pretty well, and I usually find myself sitting between 15 and 25 minutes. It's nothing mystical or magical, I just sit and try to stay sitting. When it feels right, I take a deep breath in, gassho, and I'm done. If anything feels "unresolved", I can do another sitting later (and I've done this a few times). After all, I think it's the *quality* of the sitting, not the length of time.

Just a funny side note on the quality of the time: I can sit zazen for 15 minutes and not focus on any particular thoughts. I can also sit on the couch for 45 minutes watching a show on Netflix, and focus on too many thoughts....so many that I don't remember much about the show I was just "watching".

Gassho--

--JimH (SatToday!)

Jim thanks for sharing. Guess with practice this to may come to me.

[JimH]

Jim thanks for sharing. Guess with practice this to may come to me.

Seishin-Do, I wouldn't get hung up on it. I don't think it's the time spent sitting or how you measure it that is important. I've used the Insight timer on my phone for most of the last year, and only started sitting without it over the last 5-7 months. I had my timer set for 20 minutes, with a tone going off at 10 minutes. If I had to guess, I would think that maybe somehow I trained my subconscious to measure the time. Who knows? I've also noticed that if I go much past 25 minutes, my foot starts to fall asleep, so I can usually guess the 25-minute mark.

Maybe I have it wrong, but I think that's the beauty of shikantaza: you are just sitting, not concerned about time, not measuring time, just.....sitting. You notice that no one seems to put a time count in their "sat today" signature? (i.e., no "sat 15 minutes today", just "sat today").

Sit....just don't wobble.

Gassho--

--JimH (SatToday!)

[Shokai]

However, if you are waiting for the bell to ring you've got it wrong.
And, Jim, maybe you should increase the speech rate on Netflix so yo don't have time to include thoughts

gassho,

sattoday (not sure how long)

[Jundo]

Maybe I have it wrong, but I think that's the beauty of shikantaza: you are just sitting, not concerned about time, not measuring time, just.....sitting. You notice that no one seems to put a time count in their "sat today" signature? (i.e., no "sat 15 minutes today", just "sat today").

Yes, sitting Shikantaza is beyond measure and time. Lovely.

And, yet, too we sit for a certain measure of time (in the old days, it was the time for an incense stick to burn down, now it is by the clock). That is necessary for most people too, because we have ceremonies to attend to if a monk, work to get to if a householder. So, most folks do not have the luxury of just sitting until they feel like getting up.

Thus, true Shikantaza is to sit in time and beyond time at once, thinking-not-thinking in thought and beyond thoughts as one, in Nirvana and Samsara as one, Buddha beyond time and Sentient Beings on the clock not apart. Shikantaza is beyond all time, and yet the minutes tick by.

When sitting, do not think about the time. Set the clock, then forget about it. When the bell rings or the clock strikes the time, get up. If choosing not to use a clock, when the time is right and your heart rings, get up. Simple as that.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Seishin]

I must admit when I first started sitting again and with a timer my mind was on the finishing bell but not for many weeks now. Now it just signifies the start of the rest of the day. Like this morning I ignored it, as i was in that sweet spot, kinda of in the zone, truly embracing each moment and a rare few minutes when I wasn't grabbing clouds. So I just stayed on the bus, until I thought "that will do for now" - seems I can tell as well Jim - without knowing I'd sat for nearly 6 more minutes but truly without thinking of that time. These fleeting moments come more often now but are never sought after and when they don't, it is what it is just sitting.

Gassho Jim Shokai and Jundo for your insight

[Jishin]

I got stuff to do. All day long. Run run run! To pretend I don't have stuff to do when sitting is a lie. So when sitting, I run run run run! Vroom vroom vroom! Then when I get up I run run run. Run faster, run slower. Just run.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_

[Jakuden]

I got stuff to do. All day long. Run run run! To pretend I don't have stuff to do when sitting is a lie. So when sitting, I run run run run! Vroom vroom vroom! Then when I get up I run run run. Run faster, run slower. Just run.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_

Yes this is us. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1VuMdLm0ccU

Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday




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[Jishin]

Look! Jishin and Jakuden in perfect stillness!

That's what I am talking about.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_

[Seishin]

BTW for you two, just to say retirement changes nothing, the wheels just keep on turning.......................

[Jakuden]

Haha!! Guess we are all going nowhere together very fast!
Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday


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