Zazen With Glasses!?

[sittingzen]

Hi Bjorn,

I feel blind w/out my glasses/contacts. That being said, I sit without them. Like others, my natural state feels most comfortable and my eyes are not strained.

[Seisou]

I have worn glasses my entire life. I have been sitting on and off for 25 years. Always kept them on. Never thought about. Now I'm thinking about it.

[Jundo]

'Seeing Clearly' in a Zen Way is not a matter of glasses on or off.

The clearest glass, if a hindrance, is not seen clearly.

You are sitting within the Buddha's Eye yet cannot see.

[Mp]

'Seeing Clearly' in a Zen Way is not a matter of glasses on or off.

The clearest glass, if a hindrance, is not seen clearly.

You are sitting within the Buddha's Eye yet cannot see.

This is great Jundo.

Gassho
Shingen

[Genki]

Thank you all for your thoughts!

Drop the glasses
Thinking to much
Drop the thinking

Gassho
Björn


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[Yukontodd]

I sit with mine, usually. Sometimes I find myself very distracted by the lower frame being right in my line of vision, so I just take them off and get back to sitting. Occasionally I decide they need a cleaning very badly before I start, and I sit without them from the beginning, setting them by the sink so I'll wash them when I get up. This is funny behaviour, really; I hadn't given it a lot of thought before now, but it is funny I don't just wash them before I sit, if they're dirty.

[Jundo]

A post on another thread today, but touches on this so I post here too....

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I have had eye pain during Zazen for the last few years. I have discovered that since being upgraded (or downgraded ?) to trifocals I need to remove my glasses durimg Zazen or the strain on my eyes is unbearable. Not sure if you wear corrective eyewear or not.
Gassho, Jakudo.

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Well, we were speaking on another thread about "Seeing Clearly" meaning that sitting with or without glasses is just the same when the mind is free. That mental resistance to having glasses on or off is precisely that ... mental.

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?11357-Zazen-With-Glasses%21

However, if one is truly having physical pain, headaches or eyestrain or the like caused by glasses, then it is wise to remove them. That is a different situation.

It is a bit like we say that we sit with the small discomforts of Zazen, paying them no nevermind. But if the situation truly is extreme, avoidable and could cause damage, then it is fine to try to take action. An old post on that topic:

Itchy nose, achy leg, earthquake ... when to move, when not?

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?7735-Itchy-nose-achy-leg-earthquake-when-to-move-when-not

Gassho, J

[Jishin]

I usually sit with my glasses on, and have lived and sat long enough that I now wonder about taking out or turning off the hearing aids.
Robert

I take my hearing aids off when sitting. I can see better without them during sitting.

Gassho, John

[toshiro_mifune]

Problem with eyes in zazen

I was wondering if anyone else has been experiencing problems with their eyes in Zazen. When I sit in Zazen, my eyes tend to move involuntarily, they hurt, I get tears, the focus keeps shifting even though I am trying to keep them unfocused. It ruins my sitting. I use eye drops, I have tried everything, nothing helps, I end up just getting angry. I am relatively new to zazen, but I have practiced the shamata meditation before in a different tradition, with eyes closed and it's been working much better. My eyes have always been very sensitive to light, I work with computers, and being of European stock, my eyes are obviously anatomically different from the Chinese/Japanese type. Asked a few Zen teachers, the answers so far provided nothing of practical value.

Can anyone please offer some advice, or it this God telling me to switch to another school of Buddhism?

Gassho,
Mike

[Taigu]

This is what I have to say.
See an eye specialist an explain in detail what takes place. May be go for a second opinion. Check the medical side of things.

From now on and fir a while sit with eyes closed BUT FOCUS ON SOUNDS, IN OTHER WORDS, USE YOUR EYES AS A GENTLE GAZE NOT TO BE TOO MUCH DISTRACTED BY DREAMS AN THOUGHTS, THIS IS KANNON PRACTICE.

After a few weeks on months, alternate eyes closed and eyes opened. When pain and discomfort met, go back to losed eyes and ear gazing.

Gassho

T.

[Jundo]

Hi Mike,

What are you doing with you eyes while sitting that is different from any other time of your day? Eating breakfast, for example, driving the car or looking out a window? There should be no difference in our way. Do you have tears and such at those times? What do you mean that you are "trying to keep them unfocused?"

As I said on another thread about eyes this week ...

Hi,

My belief, when something like this comes up, is that folks must be doing something unnatural with the eyes during sitting. For example, holding them too rigidly on a fixed point of focus, or too artificially trying --not-- to look at/focus on an object.

I just sit, looking out through my half open eyes, no differently than if were sitting at my kitchen table looking at the room or driving a car looking at the road. If looking at the wall, I am just looking as if looking at any scenery. Normal vision, but I just am not particularly thinking about, pondering or concentrating on what I am seeing. There is no eye strain.

Perhaps you are trying too hard --not-- to let the eyes settle on something, and that is the cause of the strain?

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?11359-Trouble-focusing

Gassho, J

[toshiro_mifune]

Hi Mike,

What are you doing with you eyes while sitting that is different from any other time of your day? Eating breakfast, for example, driving the car or looking out a window? There should be no difference in our way. Do you have tears and such at those times? What do you mean that you are "trying to keep them unfocused?"

What is different is that the eyes are moving. I am free to move them looking at different things. The main focus is always on something, but that something changes every second or so. When driving the car again I try to keep the entire range in sight, but switching the primary focus in different directions, including the rear mirror to make sure I don't have the police behind me. But it's not the same as in meditation, where I should aim at no movement.

By keeping them "unfocused", I mean trying to maintain the 180 degree vision field and not focusing on any particular point on the floor (while not moving my eyes). That is the instruction I have encountered many times.

Gassho,
Mike

[toshiro_mifune]

This is what I have to say.
See an eye specialist an explain in detail what takes place. May be go for a second opinion. Check the medical side of things.

From now on and fir a while sit with eyes closed BUT FOCUS ON SOUNDS, IN OTHER WORDS, USE YOUR EYES AS A GENTLE GAZE NOT TO BE TOO MUCH DISTRACTED BY DREAMS AN THOUGHTS, THIS IS KANNON PRACTICE.

After a few weeks on months, alternate eyes closed and eyes opened. When pain and discomfort met, go back to losed eyes and ear gazing.

Gassho

T.

Thank you Taigu. I will definitely use your advice. And yes, I have seen specialists several times, everything is good according to them, some people are more sensitive to light, some less. If you work with computers, this comes with the territory, they say.

Gassho,
Mike

[Taigu]

Also check Jundo s direction. You might be doing something funny and extra when you sit.
Anywaytake great care.

Gassho

Taigu

[Bunny]

I sometimes would sit with glasses on, sometimes off. Just depended on what my eyes needed at each sitting. Sometimes gazing down at an angle and so close to a wall would bother my eyes with the glasses on, sometimes not. It didn't seem the kind/compassionate thing to do to force my eyes into whichever way was causing distress. Seems to me you can't go wrong by choosing the compassionate/kind option.