Fear of (method of) death

[AlanLa]

Interesting thing came up with me today. I am quite generally not afraid of death. BUT I am afraid of horses; seriously, while riding a horse I have an incredible fear that I will fall and the horse will step on my head and kill me, or else I will just die from the fall. Yes, of course it is just a phobic reaction, a delusion extreme, but it got me to thinking:

Do you fear death, or do you fear how you will die?
Is there a difference like I found?

I don't feel I have any problem dying from other causes: car accidents are a frequent vision, illness is also a recurrent theme. Old age as a means of death has never, ever, been a consideration. I don't contemplate living more than another decade or so, which would put me in the early 60's, because my body is breaking down pretty rapidly due to disability, which I fully accept. To give a little background, this is an improvement. I was convinced for the longest time that I would die by 42, another wild delusion extreme.

[ndangelo]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

I believe you are right. There is a big difference between the two. One is the end of a single cycle of life. The other is the suffering that would bring you to that end. Your fears feel normal to me. I am not afraid of dying, but I am afraid of a painful death by methods I have always feared.

I think I will recite the Metta Sutra, or just the core sentence. In Pali: Sabbe, Sabba, Sukhi, Hontu.

in Metta,

Nick

[Dokan]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Interestingly enough I never really think about death. Just never seems to be something I ponder at all. There are obvious moments where thoughts arise, but I really don't dwell on it. And definitely not to the level of how or where it might happen. I'd like to think that I don't because I am too busy living... but in reality I am probably too shallow or maybe just easily distracted by shiny baubles. :lol:

Gassho

Dokan

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[Amelia]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Do you fear death, or do you fear how you will die?
Is there a difference like I found?

I do fear death. It has been something of an off and on obsession for me. I'm not really afraid of how I'll die, though that is part of it. I am simply generally afraid because I know, at some point, my body will lose its function, that I will most likely be in pain or high stress as it happens, and then at that point everything I know will be gone, all afterlife theories aside. Sometimes, when I'm feeling quiet, this knowledge will rise up in me, real and tangible: I will die. Maybe soon, maybe far off, or maybe in-between. I get the feeling of a panic attack. It reminds me of when one of my pet rats was dying of respiratory illness. I couldn't afford to put her down, so all I could do was to try and make her comfortable. It took her days to pass away. Every once in a while, she would start to bounce around in a panic, looking like she desperately wanted to escape from the fact that her body did not work like she wanted it to. It seemed to happen after her quieting down, like once she was on the verge of actually dying, she would try and snap herself out of it. It was heartbreaking to watch.

We have so little control.

[RichardH]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

I fear sudden death, because of the awful shock it gives those left behind, and hope that death will come in a way that gives people time to say goodbye. The downside is that they see you waste away, but it is better than a shocking death. In terms of my own sensual experience, getting eaten by a large carnivore is at the bottom of my list.

[AlanLa]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Amelia: We have so little control.

Yes, exactly. But to what degree of loss of control brings up a fear of death?
At what degree of loss control do we start to fear death? or anything for that matter?
At what point is it loss of control of life or loss of control of death?
And isn't the whole point of control something our practice teaches us to let go of?
YES

[Kyonin]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

This is a topic I have thought about a lot in the past. I don't fear death because I have lived the way I want to live and I know that every path has an end.

I am okay with the idea I will cease to exist. Sometimes I think it's pretty much like sleeping. When you close your eyes, you lose conscience until morning. The difference of course is that you don't wake up on death.

Of course I have never been in a situation where I see the end of the road. Only time will tell how I really react to that.

Now as for the way I will die, I feel a little fear since I'm a big chicken for pain. But then again, no one knows how the end will be.

But knowing that life has an end, makes my life precious and I cherish every waking moment. I have no idea if I will live to see tomorrow, so as for now, my life is perfect in all its imperfections.

[Ryumon]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

For me, there are at least two things. I don't think I fear death as such, but I fear dying; the pain or suffering that leads up to death when you're sick.

The second thing is that this world is such a wonderful place - in good times or in bad - that I'd miss it. Not that I'd know I'd miss it, since I won't be here, but it seems that there is so much to discover that I'll never have time to discover...

[Omoi Otoshi]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

I used to work in palliative care, slow death.
Now I work in intensive care, sudden death.
You never get closer to life.

Many people say they are not afraid to die, and it's great that they don't go around feeling a constant fear of death. But I have seen many people who have said they are not afraid of dying be very, very afraid when the time comes, even when their pain and physical suffering has been alleviated. Other times, people who have been afraid to die ever since they got their diagnosis eventually accept their condition and die very peacefully. It's hard to tell beforehand. Death is sometimes ugly. Sometimes beautiful. Sometimes, when a person died in peace, in their home, surrounded by their familily, when I left, I couldn't help crying. Not because the person had died, but because it was so beautiful.

In this moment, I'm not afraid of dying. When the time comes, maybe I will be. If so, I hope I will be able to let go and just be afraid.

/Pontus

[Jinyo]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Amelia - I feel like you do - sometimes I feel afraid thinking about death.

But what Omoi writes is true - the manner in which a person meets their death can't be
predicted.

My father and mother in law both died in recent years, and their death's were very diffferent, one
peaceful (after much suffering) and one distressing.

I am hoping that when my time comes - because I have been afraid - I will recognise my fear as an old friend - rather than an enemy.
I am trying right now to make peace with my fear.

[AlanLa]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

When afraid be afraid. I think that's part of our Path.
But don't be afraid of being afraid.

[RichardH]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Fear is a funny thing. If I completely experience fear, it is no longer fear. For fear to be felt as fear, it needs to be only partially conscious, while attention is absorbed in the object (real or imagined) that is triggering the fear. The feeling of fear goes "poof" the instant it is completely experienced, completely conscious. It can't stand alone. Fear can only flourish in the shadow of awareness. When there is a fearful situation, I find there tends to be an alternating between being awake and fearless, and being absorbed in the story and fearful. This is the edge of practice for me, where something is not integrated.

[Ray]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Something has happened to me recently that has never happened before: Every night when I lie down to sleep, I am about to drift off and just when the drifting starts, I feel a big shock, more than fear because when I feel fear I have learned to bring awareness to it and it is just a funny feeling in the pit of my tummy.

This is something I have never felt before and the thoughts in my head at this time is that "One day I will die and will no longer exist" It was as if before I have this thought I was going around all day thinking I am somehow invincible to death.

Will Kabat Zinn had suggested sometimes sitting and repeating the words "I will die" over and over again. Sounds like lots of fun especially before the start of the weekend. I tend to just return to the blue sky. However, I can understand the benefit in occasionally accepting that we will one day die in a way where we are fully accepting of it. I guess dying is the only certainity in this life.

Gassho

Ray

ps as The Foo Fighters sing "Nobody is getting out of here alive"

[Kaishin]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

I do not fear death, but I do fear the repurcussions for those around me.

I am in my early-30s, however... check with me again in 10 years and maybe I will have a different attitude!

[Rich]

Re: Fear of (method of) death

Some day this body will disappear and there will be some fear and anxiety about that. During the dying process my late wife had to deal with that and found the way thru it and died. Very happy and peaceful. I think she understood that there is a universal consciousness. Or substance of which we are a manifestation of so we just return to it.

If the death process is painful, painkilling drugs are acceptable. We'll see.