Interesting experiences during Shikantaza

[Doshin]

Although we all come to this practice seeking something, we come to find out that what we seek is something we already have and no one can give us anything.


Gassho,

Risho
-stlah

Doshin
St

[Kevin Benbow]

I am not sure what you are trying to perceive, Kevin. You are just sitting with your ordinary perceptions - what you hear, see, taste, smell, touch and think (you doubtless know that Buddhism has six senses of which mental consciousness is the sixth rather than anything mystical or "I see dead people" ).

There is nothing to perceive aside from that.

Zen is, in the end, nothing special but becoming intimate with the world through sitting allows us to experience it more fully.

Gassho
Kokuu
-sattoday-

Hmmm.. .

I think I must be still chasing something.

Thanks!

Gassho

Sat today

[Kevin Benbow]

I came to Zen via martials arts, when we meditated shikantaza like after sparring to ensure students left the dojo in a calm state and not hyped up ready to strike. I first read Suzuki's Zen Mind Beginners Mind, A Western Approach To Zen by Christmas Humphrey and then Three Pilars of Zen. As you say it seemed to whole point of sitting was to chase kensho or enlightenment itself. I sat off and on for a good few years to deal with the stresses of work but nothing happened. Nada consequently I gave up.

Roll forward to a few years after I took early retirement and due events leading up to leaving work, was in a dark unhappy place I returned to those books. Started sitting and then because of my location (Brit in France ergo language challenges) started looking for a Sangha and found Treeleaf. Went through all the Beginner lessons and discovered there was no need to chase but sit for the sake of sitting. Just sit. I joined the sangha in Sept 2016 and have sat everyday since. I still have days when I question is it good or bad zazen but just let those thoughts pass or at least try.

These days I have no expectation and just plump up the zafu and sit. Would not have it any other way. Simples.

Sat but I guess I gave that away ;-)

Hi Seishin:

I practiced the martial arts as well.

Meditations were different between different styles.

My life has been one of constant pursuit. Like a dog chasing its tail. Hard habit to break.

Gassho

Klb

Sat today

[Ishin]

Wow, I am impressed with my Sangha in these answers here! It’s almost as if some of you have been paying attention all this time.

I just wanted to add that chasing after mystical experiences is not the point of practice. If you find a Buddha, kill him.
Desire for enlightenment is pushing it further away.


The practice of sitting has no purpose, has no place, has no preferences for good/bad, gain/loss. If you’re sitting hoping to gain or become something then you’re not sitting as a Buddha.

For me motivation used to come from suffering, I think this has shifted to me not wishing to be the cause of suffering.

Gassho
Ishin
Sat/ lah

[Sekishi]

I think I must be still chasing something.

Thats OK. I'll go out on a limb and guess that everyone who practices the Soto / Shikantaza way has had the experience of discovering yet another layer of grasping / chasing after something with sitting.

We just keep sitting. The subtle ways we engage in transactional practice will be illuminated from time to time. Smile when you see one, it is a gift.

Gassho,
Sekishi
#sat

[Kevin Benbow]

So it happens when we sit and stop striving for it.

Gassho

Klb

Sat today

[Kevin Benbow]

Thats OK. I'll go out on a limb and guess that everyone who practices the Soto / Shikantaza way has had the experience of discovering yet another layer of grasping / chasing after something with sitting.

We just keep sitting. The subtle ways we engage in transactional practice will be illuminated from time to time. Smile when you see one, it is a gift.

Gassho,
Sekishi
#sat

Glad to hear I am not alone!

[Jundo]

Radically dropping all need to seek is bottomless, boundless, timeless.

All things are perfectly all things. That does not mean that things are perfect, and they are more often imperfect to human eyes. MS is imperfect, and terrible so. Yet MS is perfectly MS. When it flares it flares, when it does not flare it does not flare. While we might seek treatment or a cure, we might also simultaneously drop all need to seek, treat or cure.

Maybe then there is something to find which has always been present, beyond "sickness vs. health" too.

Gassho, J

STLah

PS - Kevin, there is nothing to change ... but would you mind uploading a human face picture with your posts? It is one of the ways we have around here to keep it a bit human, and look each other in the eye.

[Kevin Benbow]

Radically dropping all need to seek is bottomless, boundless, timeless.

All things are perfectly all things. That does not mean that things are perfect, and they are more often imperfect to human eyes. MS is imperfect, and terrible so. Yet MS is perfectly MS. When it flares it flares, when it does not flare it does not flare. While we might seek treatment or a cure, we might also simultaneously drop all need to seek, treat or cure.

Maybe then there is something to find which has always been present, beyond "sickness vs. health" too.

Gassho, J

STLah

PS - Kevin, there is nothing to change ... but would you mind uploading a human face picture with your posts? It is one of the ways we have around here to keep it a bit human, and look each other in the eye.

Thanks Jundo:

So, as has been said before, everything is exactly as it is supposed to be. The fundamental human problem is non-acceptance of their own personal reality, albeit not fatalistically. My reality is that medication is currently working, but even if this changes in the future, it will still be as it is supposed be.

I know that I suffer when I cling to the way I want things to be rather than how they are. This includes "seeking" some experience or "realization" during zazen.

Of course, easier said than done.

Gassho.

Kevin

sat today

[Jundo]

Thanks Jundo:

So, as has been said before, everything is exactly as it is supposed to be.

Well, as is exactly all and as it is, and we can leave the "supposed to" or no "supposed to" aside. A shiny jewel still shines whether it is supposed to shine or not.

Gassho, J

STLah

[Kevin Benbow]

Well, as is exactly all and as it is, and we can leave the "supposed to" or no "supposed to" aside. A shiny jewel still shines whether it is supposed to shine or not.

Gassho, J

STLah

Ah ha!

Because "supposed to" implies a self doing the "supposing."

Delusion IS persistent.

Gassho

Klb

Sat today