no goal vs motivation

[bayamo]

it is important to have "no goal" towards ones practice, but is it harmful to have "motivation"? I mean, I sit zazen ("really sit", cross legged) first thing in the morning and last thing (well, second to last, I pray afterwards) before bed. I "mindfully" ride the bus to and from work using a meditation app. And I look forward to these moments. I like the calmness, I like how my "downtime" helps me in my interactions with others, I like how it helps me keep (or at least trying to keep) in the moment throughout the day. Is this a type of goal?
#sattoday

[Jishin]

Hi,

It sounds exausting like swimming upstream.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_

[Meitou]

it is important to have "no goal" towards ones practice, but is it harmful to have "motivation"? I mean, I sit zazen ("really sit", cross legged) first thing in the morning and last thing (well, second to last, I pray afterwards) before bed. I "mindfully" ride the bus to and from work using a meditation app. And I look forward to these moments. I like the calmness, I like how my "downtime" helps me in my interactions with others, I like how it helps me keep (or at least trying to keep) in the moment throughout the day. Is this a type of goal?
#sattoday

Hi Bayamo,
You might be interested in this recent thread, where people are discussing 'the goal-less goal' of practice.

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?16995-Seeking-Nothing-vs-Goal-Setting

Gassho
Meitou
sattodaylah

[bayamo]

Thanks!

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[Jundo]

Hi Bayamo,
You might be interested in this recent thread, where people are discussing 'the goal-less goal' of practice.

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?16995-Seeking-Nothing-vs-Goal-Setting

Gassho
Meitou
sattodaylah

Thank you. I feel that this "no goal" aspect is very much misunderstood. Here was my response in that thread.

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?16995-Seeking-Nothing-vs-Goal-Setting&p=241661&viewfull=1#post241661

Yes, there are times to sit without goal at all, such as during Zazen or Kinhin, when our only goal is to sit to sit, walk this walk. If riding the bus and practicing there ... ride to just ride. As the bus moves forward, there is no place to go!

However, if we truly had no goal, we could not function. I have goals all day, from pick up the kids at school to go to the gym to dust the house.

Much better is to learn to experience life two ways at once as one, not one not two: Namely, goals AND goallessness AT ONCE! Climbing, working, planning, multi-tasking, striving ... yet also just this and this and this, here and here and here, experienced back and forth as if seeing the world two (not two) different ways.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

[bayamo]

Thank you. I feel that this "no goal" aspect is very much misunderstood. Here was my response in that thread.

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?16995-Seeking-Nothing-vs-Goal-Setting&p=241661&viewfull=1#post241661

Yes, there are times to sit without goal at all, such as during Zazen or Kinhin, when our only goal is to sit to sit, walk this walk. If riding the bus and practicing there ... ride to just ride. As the bus moves forward, there is no place to go!

However, if we truly had no goal, we could not function. I have goals all day, from pick up the kids at school to go to the gym to dust the house.

Much better is to learn to experience life two ways at once as one, not one not two: Namely, goals AND goallessness AT ONCE! Climbing, working, planning, multi-tasking, striving ... yet also just this and this and this, here and here and here, experienced back and forth as if seeing the world two (not two) different ways.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

Think I need this, but I understand all of it and nothing at the same time.

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[Jakuden]

It sounds great to me, as long as you aren't expecting to "get" something in particular out of it. Actually, it sounds a lot like what I think of as "Bodhicitta." The mind of awakening, or the desire for enlightenment out of compassion for others.

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH