Neurotic about my posture

[Ic90]

Gassho.

I'm fairly new to zazen, having begun practicing seriously about 2 months ago. For the first month or so, zazen was pretty simple mechanically speaking for me. My knees don't really allow full lotus, but sitting half lotus most of the time, and Burmese on particularly sore days wasn't a problem.

Over the past few weeks though, I've found myself becoming increasingly neurotic about my posture. I'm constantly worried that my back is not straight, even when it is. Or that my eyes are not closed enough, or focused at a perfect 45 degree angle. I am constantly adjusting my chin to make sure it is "pulled in" correctly. My shoulders bother me, always seeming to feel too far forward or too far back.

I've tried to simply let go of this and silently reassure myself that my posture is good enough, and to just focus on my breathing. Sometimes this works for a little bit, but I always seem to return to this neuroticism about my posture. I'm reaching out to see if anyone else has gone through this, and to ask for any advice anyone may have.

Sat/lah
Ian

[Houzan]

Hi Ian,
I have not, but one thing that helped me increasingly relax into the traditional form was to do zazen lying down in bed, and on a chair, and just walking (something I had to do a period due to a long covid effect). Maybe it could be helpful to intentionally try some sits while sitting on a chair, or lying down. Im sure others here will provide better advice

Gassho, Hōzan
Satlah

[Shujin]

Hi Ian,

I remember going through some of the things you're describing when I was new to sitting. It's a good thing to take it seriously, as you're doing. Body position is important - we can't sit like a wet noodle, or in some type of unbalanced posture. Having said that, good posture is necessary, but not sufficient to shikantaza. If we're caught up in thoughts about whether we're sitting "correctly", we can't relax.

We're at somewhat of a disadvantage in an online sangha, but if you go to a physical zen sangha, there are people sitting in a variety of positions. Some of them may be "better" or "worse", but none of them are perfect. Please be kind to yourself, and enjoy your practice.

Gassho,
Shujin
st/lah

[Bion]

Hi, friend. So, while some of it can be just you putting pressure on yourself, some of it might actually be physical. Zazen might not "add" anything, but it surely reveals a lot the more we spend time with it. What I mean by that is that, as you're paying more and more attention to yourself you might be discovering things about yourself even physically. You seem to have grasped the idea that you need to not hyper focus on posture, so I won't get into that.

Do, however, try to figure out whether a different placement on the zafu (further back, further forward or more angled) makes a difference. If the shoulders seem stiff, try putting a cushion on your lap for the hands to rest on, and take pressure off the shoulders.

You should absolutely approach this with a sense of curiosity and a spirit of investigation. Zazen is not merely mental, but also physical, and just as the mind reacts to it, so does the body. If you need help figuring out the posture, I'd be more than happy to have a look at it with you.

Most importantly, relax into your sitting! Not a single Buddha appeared just because of perfectly upright posture or a tucked in chin!

gassho
sat lah

[Taiji]

Heya, Ian,

I can't give any advice, but I've struggled with some of the same things, so you're not alone.

For what it's worth, this is just my personal experience with it: Some days when I sit, the anxious little hamster on the squeaking wheel between my ears is very worried about...well, whatever it's latched onto that day; very rarely, it isn't so concerned and might even take a nap...but not most days. Some days my body hurts enough that that's all I think about; some days it doesn't hurt so much. Most of the time I'm able to sit upright; sometimes a migraine requires me to "sit" lying down with the lights off. And so on. But whatever it is, there I am, so I try my best to accept it as the particular adventure of the day, anxious brain hamster and all. I am often...uh...not so skillful at this. But I bumble my way through as best as I can.

I'm glad you're here practicing with us!

Gassho,
Taiji
Sat/LAH Today

[Ic90]

Thank you all so much for the thoughtful replies.

After reading what Bion said, I think I may have unknowingly been looking at this from the wrong perspective. Instead of panicking or thinking I'm doing something "wrong", I should approach all of this with a spirit of curiosity. I think this pretty cleanly maps onto something Suzuki-roshi talked about in Zen Mind, Beginner's Mind, which is the concept of the "worst horse being the best horse". Encountering difficulty or discomfort in my zazen practice isn't some evidence of "failure", it is just zazen. Zazen is not a competition, and considering that I am still early in my practice it is predictable that I would fall into this dualistic idea of needing to "do zazen perfectly", or achieve something. The answer is in the practice itself - we let go of our gaining ideas and just sit.

Sorry for the rambling, and thanks again for the replies! I'm very thankful to have found this sangha early in my practice!

Gassho
Sat/lah today
Ian

[Junsho]

Hi Ian,
As a student, I can only share what I have experienced. In this case, my personal advice is to not hold on to anything. The mind is like a wild horse that, if left uncontrolled, will run away in any direction. So, when this kind of thought arises, bring your attention back to the present moment.

Gassho and deep bows
SatLah

[Jundo]

Do not obsess about anything, especially Zazen!

Find any posture that feels balanced, stable and comfortable, allowing one to sit comfortably for the sitting. One size does not fit all. Then, as they say in they in they in the Bronx too ...

image.png

Realize that "balanced, stable and comfortable" is partly a matter of the body (yes, if in the Lotus, get the knees down, the back upright but not too rigid), but it is also a matter of relaxing THE MIND. Accept what is, allow, release the hand of thought clutching your posture and Just Sit. If the body needs, it can be in a chair ... or even reclining if in poor health ... but the same rule of thumb applies: Be as balanced, stable and comfortable as you can, then let go and accept, forget and return to the breath or open awareness.

Your posture is not obsessing. YOUR HEAD is obsessing about your posture.

Around this Sangha, we very much recommend this book ... which helps you find the posture(S) (because more than one) right for your body. If it feels okay, it is okay.

https://forum.treeleaf.org/forum/teacher-talks-tips/teacher-talks-tips-aa/vital-points-of-shikantaza-zazen/2139-book-recommendation-the-posture-of-meditation

Gassho, Jundo
stlah