Lay practice

[Bob-Midwest]

Hopping this is the proper place to post, seek guidance.
I sit regularly with morning groups here, for which I feel very grateful. I sit again alone in the evenings.
I also occasionally attend the informal tea house gathering and donate financially on a regular basis.
I want to become more involved, but after decades of participating deeply in a few sanghas/communities, I am hesitant, weary. I know I don’t want anything to do with robes, but am open to formal commitments, precepts hoping to deepen my practice.
What options are available here?

Also, any resources here or suggestions about moving forward as lay person without the traditional contact/guidance from a teacher?

Thanks ahead of time.

sat, lah
bob

[Jundo]

Hi Bob,

Well, the best way to deepen your practice is to engage in practice activities more deeply. Around here, we have dozens of little groups, gatherings and readings which one can pour oneself into, some of which may resonate with your heart. That is the best way. No fancy robes needed!

Of course, you are invited to undertake Jukai next Fall (and to informally undertake the Precepts in your heart in a few weeks.) Most importantly is to live gently, and to learn from the Buddhist teachings, right now and each day. The ceremony just celebrates and confirms that fact.

And I think that here, in our Sangha, you have the "traditional contact/guidance from a teacher," or at least, that is the intent of this place. The only thing I would add is that there is not just one main teacher, but rather, the whole Sangha ... and many wise voices ... support, advise and encourage the whole Sangha. Play, we are available 24/7!

So, dive in deep!

Gassho, Jundo
stlah

[Houzan]

Hi Bob. I’m curious. Why hesitant? Why no robes?

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

[Bion]

Hopping this is the proper place to post, seek guidance.
I sit regularly with morning groups here, for which I feel very grateful. I sit again alone in the evenings.
I also occasionally attend the informal tea house gathering and donate financially on a regular basis.
I want to become more involved, but after decades of participating deeply in a few sanghas/communities, I am hesitant, weary. I know I don’t want anything to do with robes, but am open to formal commitments, precepts hoping to deepen my practice.
What options are available here?

Also, any resources here or suggestions about moving forward as lay person without the traditional contact/guidance from a teacher?

Thanks ahead of time.

sat, lah
bob

Bob, apart from Jukai, which Jundo has mentioned, you are invited to everything we offer as sangha activities. (All red text is links)
Come join the Weekly Precept discussions on Wednesdays (we have 2 left, I believe). Join us for the weekly and monthly zazenkai, I assume the one on Friday works best for your time zone. Join us fror the Book Club from the end of this month, if you wish. Participate in the monthly Fusatsu ceremony. Join the one day retreats, special events etc..
Have a look at our At Home Practice page for ideas for developing your own personal practice.
The Practice Opportunities section of our homepage can help you figure out what's happening, when and how to join it.
Alternatively, you can keep an eye on the Notice Board for upcoming events and meetings. There's plenty ways to be deeper involved with sangha, and they are all at your disposal.

Gassho
sat lah

[Bob-Midwest]

Hi Bob. I’m curious. Why hesitant? Why no robes?

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

It’s just so.

sat/lah
bob

[Bob-Midwest]

Bob, apart from Jukai, which Jundo has mentioned, you are invited to everything we offer as sangha activities. (All red text is links)
Come join the Weekly Precept discussions on Wednesdays (we have 2 left, I believe). Join us for the weekly and monthly zazenkai, I assume the one on Friday works best for your time zone. Join us fror the Book Club from the end of this month, if you wish. Participate in the monthly Fusatsu ceremony. Join the one day retreats, special events etc..
Have a look at our At Home Practice page for ideas for developing your own personal practice.
The Practice Opportunities section of our homepage can help you figure out what's happening, when and how to join it.
Alternatively, you can keep an eye on the Notice Board for upcoming events and meetings. There's plenty ways to be deeper involved with sangha, and they are all at your disposal.

Gassho
sat lah

Very helpful too. Thanks.

[Bion]

Very helpful too. Thanks.

My pleasure. It would make me glad to know we are able to support and nourish your practice!

Gassho
sat lah

[Myo-jin]

I think I see where you are coming from, and I think most of the technical aspects of your question have been answered. I wondered if a few comments about robes might be of use?

I received Jukai about the three years ago now, and even sewed an Okesa a bit later on. However I find th at actually it’s the precepts and the dharma that are the real Buddha robes.

While Treeleaf doesn’t offer 1 to 1 discipleship to lay students, the precepts and buddhas robe are freely given for the asking, which is the main reason I still participate here.

So perhaps a good course of action would be to observe Jukai this year, informally put on the Buddhas Robe in that sense, and then in the autumn, if you still feel called to it, sew a Rakusu and adopt the precepts and dharma formally?

It doesn’t matter if you wear a Rakusu or not, if you are already ‘wearing the robes’ so to speak.

Gassho

Sattlah

M.

[Jundo]

While Treeleaf doesn’t offer 1 to 1 discipleship to lay students

We don't? I am not sure of the word "disciple," which is not what I would say ("mentorship" is better perhaps?), but we are as "1 to 1" here as can be!
Better said, it is "Not 1 Not 2 to 1."

In other words, anyone who is sincere, dedicated and active here, and who considers this Sangha their home is as officially 100% genuine a disciplined dedicated "mentee" as can be. It don't take no formalities beyond that, and Jukai to celebrate that fact and put it down on paper. If they feel it, and act accordingly, and we all get along ... it is so. No other "secret handshake" or fancy robe or gold framed certificate needed! It just is so.

Here, the whole Sangha supports the whole Sangha, which is why it might not be so obvious.

Gassho, Jundo
stlah

[Bob-Midwest]

My pleasure. It would make me glad to know we are able to support and nourish your practice!

Gassho
sat lah

I have never come across the types of pages here you linked to - those with images. Is there a list of those somewhere? I was just aware of forum posts.

sat, lah
bob

[Seikan]

Hi Bob,

All of those links are from the main Treeleaf website:

https://www.treeleaf.org/

You can easily navigate around using the navigation bar/menu at the top of the page. The "Practice" drop-down menu, in particular, is quite rich with info.

Gassho,
Seikan
stlah

[Myo-jin]

We don't? I
Gassho, Jundo
stlah

I mean to say, without getting caught on up on words, that as far as I know nobody is going to say ‘this guy/girl is now your teacher’, but that really the precepts themselves are the important thing. Although there are plenty of folks to learn things from, but in my experience it’s been more informal.

Gassho

M.

[Hokuu]

the precepts and buddhas robe are freely given for the asking, which is the main reason I still participate here

…feeling attacked…

gassho
satlah

[Myo-jin]

…feeling attacked…

gassho
satlah

Apologies for that…I suppose what I mean is that Jundo doesn’t gatekeep the dharma, but freely offers to all that request it with sincerity and are willing to do the preliminary precept study and sewing.

Before coming here I tried a few other Buddhist groups, online and in person. When I asked about precepts it was always ‘only after so many years sitting with us’ and/or after so many sesshin, so for me it was out of the question.

That alone makes Treeleaf a one of a kind, and thus invaluable for those of us seeking the dharma while also managing a busy life.

Satlah

Gassho

M.

[Jundo]

only after so many years sitting with us’ and/or after so many sesshin, so for me it was out of the question.

That alone makes Treeleaf a one of a kind, and thus invaluable for those of us seeking the dharma while also managing a busy life.

I don't want to take too much credit, but that really depends on the Zen group and teacher. Some places have long years of waiting period and demand "exclusive" monogamy from their Jukai participants to that teacher.

But lots of (most?) places like us say that one need not wait too long, and there are moderate requirements for participation, and no requirement not to practice more with other teachers.

Some places have almost no preparation or requirements at all (which I also think is bad.)

Gassho, J
stlah