[FutureBuddha (5)] Updating Buddhism (with Buddhist Miracles through Science)

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  • Jundo
    Treeleaf Founder and Priest
    • Apr 2006
    • 40783

    [FutureBuddha (5)] Updating Buddhism (with Buddhist Miracles through Science)

    Can, will and should Buddhism change and modernize even more, leaving behind many ancient superstitions and fables ...

    ... tossing out the dubious bathwater, but keeping the Baby Buddha?

    At the same time, will future technologies help some of the most fantastic claims and miracle stories of Buddhism become real?

    Does it matter whether miracles happen through a Buddha's powers, or through scientific and medical discoveries which bring about the hoped for results?

    From my book:

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Can Buddhism change in the future, yet preserve its timeless Wisdom?

    I believe that it can.

    In truth, Buddhism has been changing and evolving through the centuries, renewing every time it entered new cultures and social settings, as human beings creatively invented and developed new teachings and interpretations (and even new visions of “Buddha”) not quite found in the formulations of earlier places and times. Nonetheless, there are certain core teachings and beliefs that I hope to introduce in this book, principles which are shared by most Buddhists, though we come in many flavors. These core tenets remain as wise and practical today as they have throughout the centuries. I see no reason that they need be lost even into the far, far future, right to the end of time. Many of these essential teachings can mold and direct the course of that future. It is merely the presentation and surrounding wrappings and trappings that may require slight change.

    I suspect that some of Buddhism’s more fabulous claims and fantastic beliefs may prove ultimately untenable as we discover more about the universe in the future. No, the earth is not flat as many Buddhists once believed. On the other hand, science may help many truly fantastic tantric visions come to life: Today we fly in the air, see and talk to each other across vast oceans, voyage to the moon, employing powers that miracle workers alone once claimed. In the years to come, many extraordinary and fabled facets of Buddhist belief will become just as realizable, even ordinary.

    As but one example, many modern Buddhists (I am one) hesitate to chant so-called Dharani chants, finding them beyond what can be credibly believed, smacking of abracadabra. These mysterious and typically unintelligible phrases are intoned by priests to bring health and business success, appease evil spirits, make it rain, prevent earthquakes and otherwise halt disasters or make wishes come true. Nor do I personally believe in the literal existence of superhuman Bodhisattvas and other fanciful creatures that read minds, walk through solid walls and fly through the air. Many other Buddhists do believe in such things, and that is their lovely way. Others of us do not.

    However, if what matters is result, not outer forms, then we can now start to speak of ‘Data Based Dharani’, our new science charms: Terrible diseases are being cured by advanced medical magic, psychological demons of the mind are slowly being tamed by psychiatric miracles, earthquakes will be better anticipated, “force field” walls walked through, and the weather better forecast and controlled. We might learn to make it rain, and we already fly through the sky. Bodhisattva-like virtues can be enhanced in our DNA, brought to life in our bodies, and even mind reading is no longer a dream. The desired outcomes attained, we might then chant traditional Dharani together, just because the sound resonates in our hearts, or just for tradition’s sake, or simply in celebration of their sheer musical beauty.

    Gassho, J

    stlah

    ~ ~ ~

    In today's news, the following was just announced. Is it really possible to predict such complex systems so far in advance? The Buddhist "sidi" power to predict the future comes true ...

    New Machine Learning Model Can Accurately Predict Events Like Tornadoes and Hail Eight Days in Advance

    As severe weather approaches with potential life-threatening hazards such as heavy rain, hail, or tornadoes, early warnings, and precise predictions are crucial. Weather researchers at Colorado State University have provided storm forecasters with a powerful new tool to enhance the reliability of their predictions, potentially saving lives in the process. ... Led by research scientist Aaron Hill, who has worked on refining the model for the last two-plus years, the team recently published their medium-range (four to eight days) forecasting ability in the American Meteorological Society journal Weather and Forecasting. ... The model is trained on a very large dataset containing about nine years of detailed historical weather observations over the continental U.S. These data are combined with meteorological retrospective forecasts, which are model “re-forecasts” created from outcomes of past weather events. The CSU researchers pulled the environmental factors from those model forecasts and associated them with past events of severe weather like tornadoes and hail. The result is a model that can run in real-time with current weather events and produce a probability of those types of hazards with a four- to eight-day lead time, based on current environmental factors like temperature and wind.

    https://scitechdaily.com/new-machine...mug0InB2b56820
    The "mind reading" reference is to technologies such as these: AI is learning to read minds, literally ... AI-ESP

    From brain waves, this AI can sketch what you're picturing

    Researchers around the world are training AI to re-create images seen by humans using only their brain waves. Experts say the technology is still in its infancy, but it heralds a new brain-analysis industry.
    --
    Zijiao Chen can read your mind, with a little help from powerful artificial intelligence and an fMRI machine.
    Chen, a doctoral student at the National University of Singapore, is part of a team of researchers that has shown they can decode human brain scans to tell what a person is picturing in their mind, according to a paper released in November.

    Their team, made up of researchers from the National University of Singapore, the Chinese University of Hong Kong and Stanford University, did this by using brain scans of participants as they looked at more than 1,000 pictures — a red firetruck, a gray building, a giraffe eating leaves — while inside a functional magnetic resonance imaging machine, or fMRI, which recorded the resulting brain signals over time. The researchers then sent those signals through an AI model to train it to associate certain brain patterns with certain images.

    Later, when the subjects were shown new images in the fMRI, the system detected the patient’s brain waves, generated a shorthand description of what it thinks those brain waves corresponded to, and used an AI image-generator to produce a best-guess facsimile of the image the participant saw.
    The results are startling and dreamlike. An image of a house and driveway resulted in a similarly colored amalgam of a bedroom and living room. An ornate stone tower shown to a study participant generated images of a similar tower, with windows situated at unreal angles. A bear became a strange, shaggy, doglike creature.

    The resulting generated image matched the attributes (color, shape, etc.) and semantic meaning of the original image roughly 84% of the time. ... Researchers believe that in just a decade the technology could be used on anyone, anywhere. “It might be able to help disabled patients to recover what they see, what they think,” Chen said. In the ideal case, Chen added, humans won’t even have to use cellphones to communicate. “We can just think.” ....
    Like many recent AI developments, brain-reading technology raises ethical and legal concerns. Some experts say in the wrong hands, the AI model could be used for interrogations or surveillance.

    “I think the line is very thin between what could be empowering and oppressive,” said Nita Farahany, a Duke University professor of law and ethics in new technology. “Unless we get out ahead of it, I think we’re more likely to see the oppressive implications of the technology.”

    She worries that AI brain decoding could lead to companies commodifying the information or governments abusing it, and described brain-sensing products already on the market or just about to reach it that might bring about a world in which we are not just sharing our brain readings, but judged for them.

    “This is a world in which not just your brain activity is being collected and your brain state — from attention to focus — is being monitored,” she said, “but people are being hired and fired and promoted based on what their brain metrics show.”

    “It’s already going widespread and we need governance and rights in place right now before it becomes something that is truly part of everyone’s everyday lives,” she said.

    Researchers around the world are training AI to re-create images seen by humans using only their brain waves. Experts say the technology is still in its infancy, but it heralds a new brain-analysis industry.


    SHOWN BELOW IN RED: Singapore results compared to original images ...

    Last edited by Jundo; 04-03-2023, 04:24 AM.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE
  • Tai Do
    Member
    • Jan 2019
    • 1455

    #2

    Tai Do (Mateus)
    Satlah
    怠努 (Tai Do) - Lazy Effort
    (also known as Mateus )

    禅戒一如 (Zen Kai Ichi Nyo) - Zazen and the Precepts are One!

    Comment

    • Doshin
      Member
      • May 2015
      • 2634

      #3


      Buddhism must continue to change to fit the needs of a changing world. Or it can remain the same as some spiritual practices have with many no longer seeing how it fits into their lives.

      A question teacher..will Soto Zen loose more of its Japanese look as it evolves in the West? What will it look like in 2100? I ask as a westerner who understands our roots grew from India east to Japan where our specific form evolved. I assume it changed its cultural look along that journey. However as a Westerner I find Japanese chants and other aspects “foreign” and sometime uncomfortable. I am more of a western nature guy practitioner who is more likely to put a picture of a lizard under my name than Japanese symbols I believe others in the West are not attracted to our practice because it seems foreign. Others embrace the Japanese look and ways.

      Doshin
      St
      Last edited by Doshin; 01-20-2023, 07:40 PM.

      Comment

      • Tai Do
        Member
        • Jan 2019
        • 1455

        #4
        Originally posted by Doshin
        I believe others in the West are not attracted to our practice because it seems foreign. Others embrace the Japanese look and ways.
        I myself am included in the latter group: it was precisely the Japanese origins, forms and looks of Soto Zen that drove me into it when I first started my Buddhist journey.

        Gassho,
        Tai Do (Mateus)
        Satlah
        怠努 (Tai Do) - Lazy Effort
        (also known as Mateus )

        禅戒一如 (Zen Kai Ichi Nyo) - Zazen and the Precepts are One!

        Comment

        • Doshin
          Member
          • May 2015
          • 2634

          #5
          Originally posted by Tai Do
          I myself am included in the latter group: it was precisely the Japanese origins, forms and looks of Soto Zen that drove me into it when I first started my Buddhist journey.

          Gassho,
          Tai Do (Mateus)
          Satlah

          Understand Tai Do. I love the the Brazilian Restaurant about three hours from where I live. In other words I enjoy the international aspect of most things…it’s just when it comes to spiritual things I feel uncomfortable. I should add I live in the SW US so Mexican food is a big part of my life!

          Doshin
          St

          Comment

          • Jundo
            Treeleaf Founder and Priest
            • Apr 2006
            • 40783

            #6
            Originally posted by Doshin
            ...will Soto Zen loose more of its Japanese look as it evolves in the West? What will it look like in 2100? I ask as a westerner who understands our roots grew from India east to Japan where our specific form evolved. I assume it changed its cultural look along that journey. However as a Westerner I find Japanese chants and other aspects “foreign” and sometime uncomfortable. I am more of a western nature guy practitioner who is more likely to put a picture of a lizard under my name than Japanese symbols I believe others in the West are not attracted to our practice because it seems foreign. Others embrace the Japanese look and ways.
            I will venture to say that the same process we are now seeing will continue: All varieties. Some more Japanese than others (and there is a saying when some western groups really go to that extreme: "more Japanese than even the Japanese" ), some stripping that away almost completely.

            You may notice that at Treeleaf, I walk a Middle Way on this. Sometimes doing things the Indian or Chinese or Japanese way (out of respect for tradition), sometimes keeping old stuff because it is just powerful and rich old stuff (e.g., Oryoki eating ritual), sometimes modernizing.

            Many excellent ways to cook the Tofu.

            Gassho, J

            stlah
            ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

            Comment

            • Tai Do
              Member
              • Jan 2019
              • 1455

              #7
              Originally posted by Doshin
              Understand Tai Do. I love the the Brazilian Restaurant about three hours from where I live. In other words I enjoy the international aspect of most things…it’s just when it comes to spiritual things I feel uncomfortable. I should add I live in the SW US so Mexican food is a big part of my life!

              Doshin
              St
              That’s great, Doshin. Each one of us are different and have different interests and start points in the path; it’s what makes the Buddhist world such interesting and diverse. Also, I’m very curious about the menu of the Brazilian restaurant – what does people outside Brazil see as Brazilian food?

              Gassho,
              Tai Do (Mateus)
              Satlah
              怠努 (Tai Do) - Lazy Effort
              (also known as Mateus )

              禅戒一如 (Zen Kai Ichi Nyo) - Zazen and the Precepts are One!

              Comment

              • Spiritdove

                #8
                Things do not Become real they either real or not. Science does not try to make anything real. Science is a systematic and logical approach to discovering how things in the universe work . Science has a method its not about changing anything or making anything true. It actually wants to be proven wrong. I only think the stories can be used more as metaphor. I don't need any more miracle than a sun rising in the morning. Its like a story of a man pointing at the moon and saying look at the moon . I do and his finger is in the way. I don't think stories should be tossed out. You remember the aspects of a story. Like the dream that Buddha's mother had of a white elephant and Buddha coming out his side. Can this not be something besides literal? What about that time was a woman's private parts anything but considered "dirty" . So he must not have been born from that "dirty" place. This is my opinion and I could be wrong bare with me. I see things in stories . I feel its like paintings you can all see something different in a painting just like the so called miracle stories can be something deeply rooted in the psyche. I don't think you can toss them out. No more then you could toss out the myth in my own native american traditions. The power of Myth by Joseph Campbell I found a good read once. Of the Hero man stories in our history. When you chant don't you respond to that chant physically? I do an om meditation. My BP goes down. My heart rate changes. I relax. Isn't that magick enough? Your mind and body go into a union in that chant. And when your mind and body change your affecting everything around you in your actions. Again that's magick to me. Science is magick but not the kind you think. Its a process to find out what is true and when its wrong it admits it and tries again.
                I love talking science its many different avenues on how our world works and we may never know totally but science works! look at us chatting around the world!

                Marj "Spiritdove"
                Sat Today

                Comment

                • Josh7
                  Member
                  • Jan 2023
                  • 8

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Jundo
                  Can, will and should Buddhism change and modernize even more, leaving behind many ancient superstitions and fables ...

                  ... tossing out the bathwater, but keeping the Baby Buddha?

                  At the same time, will future technologies help some of the most fantastic claims and miracle stories of Buddhism become real?

                  Does it matter whether miracles happen through a Buddha's powers, or through scientific and medical discoveries which bring about the hoped for results?

                  From my book:

                  ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

                  Can Buddhism change in the future, yet preserve its timeless Wisdom?

                  I believe that it can.

                  In truth, Buddhism has been changing and evolving through the centuries, renewing every time it entered new cultures and social settings, as human beings creatively invented and developed new teachings and interpretations (and even new visions of “Buddha”) not quite found in the formulations of earlier places and times. Nonetheless, there are certain core teachings and beliefs that I hope to introduce in this book, principles which are shared by most Buddhists, though we come in many flavors. These core tenets remain as wise and practical today as they have throughout the centuries. I see no reason that they need be lost even into the far, far future, right to the end of time. Many of these essential teachings can mold and direct the course of that future. It is merely the presentation and surrounding wrappings and trappings that may require slight change.

                  I suspect that some of Buddhism’s more fabulous claims and fantastic beliefs may prove ultimately untenable as we discover more about the universe in the future. No, the earth is not flat as many Buddhists once believed. On the other hand, science may help many truly fantastic tantric visions come to life: Today we fly in the air, see and talk to each other across vast oceans, voyage to the moon, employing powers that miracle workers alone once claimed. In the years to come, many extraordinary and fabled facets of Buddhist belief will become just as realizable, even ordinary.

                  As but one example, many modern Buddhists (I am one) hesitate to chant so-called Dharani chants, finding them beyond what can be credibly believed, smacking of abracadabra. These mysterious and typically unintelligible phrases are intoned by priests to bring health and business success, appease evil spirits, make it rain, prevent earthquakes and otherwise halt disasters or make wishes come true. Nor do I personally believe in the literal existence of superhuman Bodhisattvas and other fanciful creatures that read minds, walk through solid walls and fly through the air. Many other Buddhists do believe in such things, and that is their lovely way. Others of us do not.

                  However, if what matters is result, not outer forms, then we can now start to speak of ‘Data Based Dharani’, our new science charms: Terrible diseases are being cured by advanced medical magic, psychological demons of the mind are slowly being tamed by psychiatric miracles, earthquakes will be better anticipated, “force field” walls walked through, and the weather better forecast and controlled. We might learn to make it rain, and we already fly through the sky. Bodhisattva-like virtues can be enhanced in our DNA, brought to life in our bodies, and even mind reading is no longer a dream. The desired outcomes attained, we might then chant traditional Dharani together, just because the sound resonates in our hearts, or just for tradition’s sake, or simply in celebration of their sheer musical beauty.

                  Gassho, J

                  stlah
                  Yes, I think it will continue to change over time...and perhaps the supernatural aspects of Buddhism will still be learned, but more in a "historical" sense of how things used to be. I like your take on technology explaining how some of these "supernatural things" can happen today such as internet and flying in an airplane. I also really like that phrase "medical magic"

                  Gassho
                  Jeff

                  sat today

                  Comment

                  • Doshin
                    Member
                    • May 2015
                    • 2634

                    #10
                    Tai Do

                    0Meat of varieties. I know many here will think this is the antithesis of Buddhism. However I am the son of 300,000 years of evolutionary biology guided by an omnivore paradigm. I focus on merging my Spiritual path and my evolutionary past to make a better world. The world will never be perfect…. Just better.
                    earth.

                    Doshin
                    St
                    Last edited by Doshin; 01-21-2023, 02:39 AM.

                    Comment

                    • Spiritdove

                      #11
                      I disagree on term "perfect" It shows that everything just "is" and then someone decides by personal preference on a idea of perfect. It is all relative. Perfects dictionary meaning says " it is having no idea of lack". Only an observer adds lack to anything and uses personal preferences of neediness in any situation. I feel we are already one with everything so nothing lacks. Affirming the world as never being perfect will only create the illusion of imperfection in oneself that is projected onto the world. IMHO
                      evolution is far older than 300,000 years


                      Fossils found in Morocco suggest the Homo sapiens lineage became distinct as early as 350,000 years ago – adding as much as 150,000 years to our species’ his...


                      and the ocean was our home beyond that. Doesn't look antithest to me. Siddhartha was not about evolution that I read so far he only sought liberation from suffering, My personal truths
                      1.life is beautiful suffering is an option
                      2. cause of happiness is wisdom and letting go of lack
                      3. then end of suffering is the joy that its not permanent
                      4. By living ethically, practicing meditation, and developing wisdom you attain liberation now not in future or unproven rebirths.
                      and it harm none do as you please

                      Marj "Spiritdove"
                      satToday
                      Last edited by Guest; 01-21-2023, 06:12 AM.

                      Comment

                      • Tokan
                        Member
                        • Oct 2016
                        • 1324

                        #12
                        Hey all

                        I've always liked the descriptions of the 'mirror' in Buddhism, serving to show a reflection back to the thing itself or the viewer. As long as Buddhism can continue to hold a mirror up to our own experience, and therefore that of the world, it will maintain it's dignity and place in the future. Just my thought.

                        Gasho, Tokan

                        satlah
                        平道 島看 Heidou Tokan (Balanced Way Island Nurse)
                        I enjoy learning from everyone, I simply hope to be a friend along the way

                        Comment

                        • Tai Do
                          Member
                          • Jan 2019
                          • 1455

                          #13
                          Originally posted by Doshin
                          Tai Do

                          0Meat of varieties. I know many here will think this is the antithesis of Buddhism. However I am the son of 300,000 years of evolutionary biology guided by an omnivore paradigm. I focus on merging my Spiritual path and my evolutionary past to make a better world. The world will never be perfect…. Just better.
                          earth.

                          Doshin
                          St
                          I also eat meat (I have been trying to stop for some time now, but it is too hard... the maximum I managed was to make two meals a day without meat). I asked about the Brazilian food because usually in foreign food restaurants we have the best of other country's cuisine, things that usually we don't find in the same restaurant on the original country, not what people there usually eat on a daily basis - I bet my family's daily meals are very different from what a Brazilian restaurant would serve.
                          Gassho,
                          Tai Do (Mateus)
                          Satlah
                          怠努 (Tai Do) - Lazy Effort
                          (also known as Mateus )

                          禅戒一如 (Zen Kai Ichi Nyo) - Zazen and the Precepts are One!

                          Comment

                          • Doshin
                            Member
                            • May 2015
                            • 2634

                            #14
                            Tai Do

                            I understand that home meals will be much different. Our home meals take in ideas from many places, nothing like the meals of my youth, I also strive to reduce my consumption of meat to lessen my environmental impact on the earth. That Brazilian restauraunt also has a nice salad bar and my wife likes the fried plantain and pineapple.as you said maybe very different from home life in Brazil

                            Doshin
                            St

                            PS if I ever make it to a Brazil to experience your wonderful biodiversity we must share a meal. And if you make it North I will prepare one! I will spare you my field menu of canned tuna
                            Last edited by Doshin; 01-21-2023, 02:25 PM.

                            Comment

                            • Doshin
                              Member
                              • May 2015
                              • 2634

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Spiritdove
                              I disagree on term "perfect" It shows that everything just "is" and then someone decides by personal preference on a idea of perfect. It is all relative. Perfects dictionary meaning says " it is having no idea of lack". Only an observer adds lack to anything and uses personal preferences of neediness in any situation. I feel we are already one with everything so nothing lacks. Affirming the world as never being perfect will only create the illusion of imperfection in oneself that is projected onto the world. IMHO
                              evolution is far older than 300,000 years


                              Fossils found in Morocco suggest the Homo sapiens lineage became distinct as early as 350,000 years ago – adding as much as 150,000 years to our species’ his...


                              and the ocean was our home beyond that. Doesn't look antithest to me. Siddhartha was not about evolution that I read so far he only sought liberation from suffering, My personal truths
                              1.life is beautiful suffering is an option
                              2. cause of happiness is wisdom and letting go of lack
                              3. then end of suffering is the joy that its not permanent
                              4. By living ethically, practicing meditation, and developing wisdom you attain liberation now not in future or unproven rebirths.
                              and it harm none do as you please
                              Marj "Spiritdove"
                              satToday
                              I used the word “perfect” a little too carelessly and I appreciated your response about the relative nature of how we see. Thank you for that.

                              Doshin
                              St

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