[EcoDharma] ECO-Life

[Seishin]

Call me pessimistic but more and more I am hearing that in our western civilisation recycling means shipping our waste to the mid and far east. Not dealing with it at source. What happens there is often just landfill and nothing gets recycled. As usual its just a snow job covering up the big problem we face and pretending to actually be helping, whilst shifting the problem elsewhere. To me this is no different to folks selling off the unacceptable high carbon footprints to places with lower carbon outputs. Its all just smoke and mirrors and a back slap for politicians who claim to have lowered pollution by passing the buck elsewhere. Have I an answer no but I do what and when I can without the rhetoric and BS.

I often think of the lyrics to this song and realise its now 48 years old and nothing has really changed.

I could go back another 10 years and cite Dylan.

My life seems to span 6 decades of inaction and a downwards spiral. I humbly apologise to all the non-human species on the planet, for we are killing you now and have killed countless of your species and will continue to kill everything until nothing is left. Unless we learn from this we will eventually kill ourselves and if anything else survives at that time, the world will then be a better place.

[Sekiyuu]

This has been a big topic on my mind for the past year, so sorry if I get rambly, but at least I come bearing links.

This is a bit anecdotal, but I used a carbon footprint calculator recently and noticed that, the majority of my footprint ended up in "secondary" sources like food, consumer goods, and other things we don't usually think of as polluters. Don't feel so bad about your driving or recycling habits, the biggest bang for your carbon buck lies in things you may have no control over like how your electricity is generated, how your food is produced and transported, or whether your local transit infrastructure allows you to ditch your car but still keep a job.

I strongly support nuclear power and strongly oppose coal power, if people 40 years ago had done the same we'd be in a much better position to rectify other climate issues. Of course, what really matters is what you personally could do to get your elected officials to shut down coal-firing plants. Coal-firing power plants in Canada (though likely elsewhere) are the single biggest greenhouse gas producers, and shutting them down is a straightforward process compared to decarbonizing our entire economy or changing everyone's eating habits. Here in Ontario there's thankfully documentation for how we got rid of our coal power:

https://www.ontario.ca/page/end-coal

Simply put, it's really the responsibility of governments and corporations in polluting industries to fix the problem. They're the ones who could pull the levers and decarbonize our economies if they really wanted to. However, the demand for the products that these polluters supply has to come from somewhere, so thankfully we have a little bit of input.

As mentioned before, reducing meat consumption helps. Specifically, beef causes the most greenhouse gasses and land usage per kilogram of meat (cows also emit methane, a greenhouse gas x20 more potent than CO2). Lamb comes in second place, and all other meats come far behind.
(https://www.theguardian.com/environm...mpact-on-earth)

I figure people on this forum are aware that vegetarian food can be delicious, but in case you wanted ideas, here's one:

https://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2015/02/sichuan-braised-eggplant-vegan-experience-food-lab-recipe.html

A very unpopular way to reduce greenhouse gases is to simply have less children or, ideally, no children:

https://www.independent.co.uk/environment/children-carbon-footprint-environment-climate-change-adoption-birth-pregnancy-a8469886.html

Children (well, people) in developed countries of course have a much bigger carbon footprint, so anyone in this forum will have a bigger impact here. Of course this is a decision you only make a few times per lifetime (if it's a decision at all) so it's not very actionable. For the record, my wife and I are taking this route, maybe we'll adopt someday, maybe not.

Outside of the climate crisis, we must also keep in mind that you can't grow a population indefinitely inside of a finite space. However, demographic trends show that this problem will generally handle itself; birth rates trend towards zero the more developed a country becomes. Developed countries only have positive population growth because of immigration, something that Japan is seemingly waking up to right now as I hear stories about its famously difficult immigration standards loosening up (a tiny bit).


You should also consider the other side of the equation: reducing the amount of carbon in the atmosphere via carbon sinks. It's probably not surprising that tree planting is the most practical way we can do it right now. If you buy an airplane ticket, depending on where you are you may be offered to pay a "carbon offset". These are basically donations to tree planting and green energy funds to even out the carbon surplus your air travel is creating. Forests provide incredible ecological benefits beyond being a carbon sink, so in my non-expert opinion I would suggest you donate to tree planting as much as you can. I think the Chernobyl exclusion zone is a thing of beauty because it shows how quickly a forest can grow and how lively it can be if we simply keep humans out of it.

I recently read a pretty cool proposal for artificial carbon sinking, but I don't think it's very practical, though the technology exists, this particular application is theoretical and probably /at best/ decades away... and we only have 11 years to make a big impact:

http://toughsf.blogspot.com/2019/06/thermal-decomposition-of-co2-with.html

Finally, if all of our efforts come to nothing, on a certain scale we can have hope that life will survive, even if most humans won't. The Earth has experienced many mass extinctions, and the Permian Extinction resembles our current crisis the most. The Earth recovered from that, so it will likely recover from us:

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/12/07/science/climate-change-mass-extinction.html

Gassho,
Kenny
Sat Today

[Meitou]

Yes, even confuses me if I look quickly. How about "Eco-Living" or something like that?

Gassho, Jundo

That's fine, let's drop living and say Eco Life. The only problem is that I can't work out how to actually change it. If you could do it for me I'd be grateful, or someone point me in the right direction? Thanks Jundo
Gassho
Meitou
sattodaylah
Thank You!!

[Doshin]

Kenny you did a good job of summarizing the Big Picture!

Being a student/outcome of Ehrlich's Population Bomb of the 60s and trained in population biology/ecology I am in complete agreement about fewer of us in itself addresses the issue at a fundamental level.

BTW I believe the average recovery time following a mass Extinction is 10 million years. I (my species) just didn't want the cause to be credited to us. However it has begun.

Doshin
St I

[Meitou]

Call me pessimistic but more and more I am hearing that in our western civilisation recycling means shipping our waste to the mid and far east. Not dealing with it at source. What happens there is often just landfill and nothing gets recycled. As usual its just a snow job covering up the big problem we face and pretending to actually be helping, whilst shifting the problem elsewhere. To me this is no different to folks selling off the unacceptable high carbon footprints to places with lower carbon outputs. Its all just smoke and mirrors and a back slap for politicians who claim to have lowered pollution by passing the buck elsewhere. Have I an answer no but I do what and when I can without the rhetoric and BS.

I often think of the lyrics to this song and realise its now 48 years old and nothing has really changed.

I could go back another 10 years and cite Dylan.

My life seems to span 6 decades of inaction and a downwards spiral. I humbly apologise to all the non-human species on the planet, for we are killing you now and have killed countless of your species and will continue to kill everything until nothing is left. Unless we learn from this we will eventually kill ourselves and if anything else survives at that time, the world will then be a better place.

Seishin, I suspect what you say is right. But the reality of right now is all we have to work with. As Kenny and others have pointed out, the problem is global, and the solution would be global if politicians and global business chose to go that route. But we know, looking at the most powerful leaders and CEO's of today that they are mostly self-serving and interested only in accumulating more power and wealth; they are a huge part of the problem. But because this is a global emergency, it transcends the feelings of You and Me. If we can each make a small effort we can at least know that we are contributing toward a greater good, not just for us but for the world. Yes, adopting a sustainable lifestyle may seem to be a drop in the ocean, sometimes a bit folksy, even a bit 'western white privilege' but it has to be done, even by a few, to keep pushing the message, to make others around us more aware of what they could also do.

I agree with Kenny and Doshin that population numbers should somehow be capped, but then I don't have children so it's easy for me to say. Unlike Kenny this wasn't my choice and caused a lot of grief initially, but I'm at peace with all of that - I do have stepchildren and step grandchildren however, and it makes me incredibly sad to think of all that I enjoyed and took absolutely for granted for a child won't be available to them, despite growing up in post war Britain. I also agree that we are headed for extinction anyway, but there's no need to rush up to meet it with open arms!

I know Seishin that you plant a lot of trees - this is hugely important, one of the most important initiatives there is, so deep bows. There's a real sadness coming through your words, I imagine many of us can identify with this. This manifestation of suffering is born out of compassion for something almost impossibly greater than us, it's almost a koan or an echo of the Four Vows - are we trying to save a world that is unsaveable? In the face of this impossible task, I think we can only adopt the same stance as we do when we vow to save all sentient beings, though beings numberless; we sit with the suffering and try to see how to convert the pain into energy to do something positive.
Gassho
Meitou
satttodaylah
PS Thank you for the Marvin Gaye, one of my all time favourites

[Meitou]

OK folks, here are some interesting links.

First of all, please keep up with Doshin's Living Earth thread here, I see it as a natural partner to this one :

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?16570-Living-Earth

From a link to the National Geographic that Doshin posted in the above thread, I found a real wealth of great articles, including this one, about how city dwellers can live a more sustainable life :

https://www.nationalgeographic.com/environment/2019/06/cities-climate-impact-consume-less/

And here are two companies, one in the US, one in the UK, that sell a range of household eco products. I've seen it suggested that folk try to convert one area of living at a time, perhaps starting with the bathroom or the kitchen. These small companies would be a great place to find ideas.
https://zerowastestore.com/ US
https://www.peacewiththewild.co.uk/ UK

Finally Kenny mentioned using a carbon footprint calculator, I found one here;

https://www.treedom.net/en/

Please keep posting any interesting or relevant links.
Gassho
Meitou
sattodaylah

[Seibu]

Wow, amazing to see such a level of engagement on such an important topic today...or as David Letterman would say: "know your current events." There are many things we can do to contribute to a better environment each day . I'll start with the bigger things that haven't been mentioned yet. Do you really need that big house? How much living space does a family really need? This website might be of interest to those considering a higher level of sustainable living: https://www.madihome.com/.

Aside from hybrid and fully electric cars, do you really need that Mercedes GLC or Cadillac Escalade? Besides heavy cars being heavier polluters they also require bigger parts. For example, compare the average tire of a Toyota Auris to that of a BMW X7. On top of that, bigger cars are heavier which means they are a bigger burden to roads than smaller cars. So why not consider to size down a bit.


Do you have solar panels on your roof? Is it possible to get them through a state or county-funded program? It's always worth looking into it. How about the insulation of your home? There are small things you can do to reduce draught such as placing cheap draught excluders on your doors or windows.

If your home is powered by a fossil fuel power plant you can still reduce electricity consumption by making minor changes to your home. For example, you could replace all traditional light bulbs with CFLs or LED bulbs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compact_fluorescent_lamp and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LED_lamp.

When you go to the supermarket do you bring your own bag and do you reuse it? Speaking of plastic, here's a website with advice on how to recycle plastic bottles: https://www.budgetdumpster.com/blog/...les-recycling/

As others have already mentioned I wholeheartedly agree with the idea of voluntary population control. Ideally the birthrates should be capped at 2.1 because that is the replacement rate to sustain the current global population, anything above that will only add to the population. Because of this, my wife and I decided to have one child only seventeen years ago. We both agreed that two would be the maximum. No offense at all to those having more than two children but this was just what felt ethically right for the both of us.

Thanks all for the great advice, I'm definitely going to check out the links that have been provided so far.

Gassho,
Jack
Sattoday/lah

[Tai Do]

I think you are right, Meitou, in that we have to incorporate a sustainable lifestyle little by little. My main concern with my wife and me adopting a more environmentally correct way of life is if we can make such a huge change and how it will affect our lives, relationships and humor. It is hard to form and mantain a new habit. As with all changes, perhaps a complete change is better when moving or changing houses. In my case, a better approach perhaps should be little changes every week or month until it became second nature to us.
Thank you all for the suggestions.
Gassho,
Mateus
Sat today

[Heiso]

Hi Meitou - I'm glad you've started this as it's something that concerns me too. I think we've spoken briefly in the past about Extinction Rebellion but I'm always looking for ways to reduce my and my family's impact so it will be great to swap some ideas.

Here are a few things we already do: try to buy second hand clothing where possible, grow as much of our own food as we can, recycle as much as we can, replace plastic with other options where possible, and minimise air and car travel.

Although we recycle all we can, as others have commented, I'm not sure how effective that is so I'm keen to hear ways we can reduce or reuse packaging and plastics in general.

I find it can be overwhelming when I think about the environmental crisis but I do have hope that we are beginning to see some real change, people are beginning to demand change from companies and their governments we just need to keep the pressure up and keep voting with our wallets!

Speaking of which, a friend of mine is in the process of setting up a platform to try and drive change from the bottom up: https://www.ourpledge.co.uk/

Gassho,

Neil

StLah.

[Ryudo]

Thank you Meitou for this thread.
Thank you all for your contributions.

Gassho/SatToday

[Kendrick]

I used to work in the recycling/reselling industry. It was unbelievable how many pounds of clothing was donated in such a small area/population. It gets sorted, then about 90% of it gets baled in a vertical press then resold to another larger facility that sorts it again and either resells it once more overseas by the pound or shreds it to be reused for things like jeans and blankets. Main point being: we overconsume immensely - I'm guilty of it too. Especially when clothing is relatively cheap for western society when compared to our wages/salaries. Those resold clothes also end up back in other economies as super cheap used clothes - while a good price for the people buying them it ends up hurting the economy in those places because it discourages new industry. So it's good they are reused or recycled (much still ends up in a landfill, however) but if we didn't use so much of it to begin with it would be even better.

There are so many ways one can reduce their carbon footprint, use fewer resources up, etc. that it can be greatly overwhelming if you try to take on every possible new habit at once. It can become obsessive like any other activity or interest for certain so that is something to be careful of. Some things may even seem like a great idea at first glance or in popular practice but upon further analysis can be found to be nothing more than trading one bad for another bad and just action for action's sake (busy-ness). I try to take a gentle approach with myself with this and do small things when I can.

Some things I try to do others can try if it works for them:

1. Use old wash cloths/rags to clean with at home instead of paper when I can (some stuff you don't want in your washer/dryer because it can dangerous like spilled oils, grease, other chemicals, etc). I just fill up a basket until I have enough for a load to wash.

2. Combine trips. I don't live in an area where I can walk to anything (illegal to walk or ride a bike along the interstate/side of the highway here) so I get my grocery trips and other shopping/errands done while already downtown for work.

3. I use very low wattage LED lighting at home (and with dimmers). 4 watts or so for most bulbs vs 13-15 watts for CFLs, or 40-60 watts for incandescent bulbs.

4. I adjust the thermostat a bit when I'm away each day - not enough to put a lot of load on it when I set it back - just a few degrees difference. Turn the temp up when I'm gone for the day during the summer, and down in the winter (and at night in the winter).

5. I sew/repair my own clothes. I actually really like the feel and look of worn-in clothing. I buy better quality clothing to begin with as well since it is less prone to shrinking oddly or falling apart. I mostly buy factory reject clothes from good brands - stuff with irregular sizing, sewing mistakes (that I fix like the pants I'm wearing right now that had one functional pocket before I cut and fixed it), damage, etc. These clothes are less likely to be purchased by someone else.

6. Along the same lines as the clothing less desired I buy groceries in the same way - great deals in the process. I buy a lot of clearance /last chance/defect food items. Most of my meat purchases fall into this category - it's stuff that is going to be thrown away in a few hours when the store closes that evening. Saves it from being wasted, and saves me money (generally about 25% off).

7. I eat less meat - only at dinner on most days.

8. I use glass storage containers. Less plastic waste and it's more sanitary (plastic absorbs things that don't get clean, and also leak chemicals into food).

9. I pack my aluminum water bottle and ceramic bowl and metal chopsticks/utensils for my lunch foods. I'm fine with tap water over buying plastic bottles or using water filters that end up in the trash.

10. Let my hands dry naturally, or wipe them on my pants when I was my hands at places instead of using paper towels. It's slightly less sanitary but it cuts way back on the amount of paper waste.


Some things I wish I could do here but don't have the resources to do:

1. Recycling Program (aside from taking metal on your own to a scrap yard there isn't a public program here).

2. Walk/Bicycle places. Not legal from where I live to do this to get into town sadly. There is public transportation but only directly in town, not in the suburbs).

3. Solar panels. Far out of my price range or capability to implement here, and I plan on moving in the not-too-distant future.

4. Have a large garden. Don't really have space for it and it isn't allowed where I live (community restrictions). I can do food plants in pots though - I've grown some herbs that way for us before but the weather and insects here give us issues. I have a peach tree that I get 1-2 peaches from every few years - all the other peaches vanish from other things eating them or get eaten by insects before they ripen.

Gassho

SatToday

[Cooperix]

Great conversation. Thanks for starting it Meitou.

My 2 cents:
Plastic straws, we've all seen the images of the sea turtle with a plastic straw stuck up her nose, or heard horror stories of dying sea life because of our addiction to plastic straws. I realize for health reasons some folks need straws to drink, but for the rest of us they are definitely not essential. I understand that California has outlawed them. If straws are offered there they are paper. Restaurants should be made aware and not offer straws, unless explicitly asked. Politely mention this issue to management. It's a little thing with a huge sad impact.

https://squareup.com/townsquare/why-plastic-straws-are-being-banned

Water, I live in the desert SW in the US. Water is a precious commodity here and we try to conserve. When I am waiting for the hot water to kick in I collect the water in pitchers to use on my garden. Many houses have rain collection gear. Will there eventually be water wars? I keep hearing that's a danger as many places on the planet have issues with potable water. Water wise landscaping, the 'don't rush to flush' advisement. Many ways to be careful with this resource.

After my mother passed away a few years back we used some of the money from my inheritance to install a solar system in our house and on my studio. Which is a win win situation as we were offered large tax breaks through the federal government and our state. Not sure how works now, with big changes in the government. But We often get money back from the utility company as we use less electricity than we generated that month.

Gassho,

Anne

~st~

[Meitou]

Again thank you everyone for such great contributions! As Anne says water is a precious commodity, we should all see it that way wherever we are out of respect for people who have a struggle to find fresh water every day, something too easy to take for granted. I live on a very dry island, and generally during the summers, the authorities turn our water off from late evening to early morning. Most of us have reserve tanks which we can draw from, but it still gives pause for thought and encourages people to be careful.

This just arrived in my inbox from the Vegan Society - and although I'm not a vegan now, I try to limit the use of animal products as much as possible.Here's their link for PLate up for the Planet, a pledge to eat vegan for a week, I'll be joining in at the beginning of July. There's also a calculator for measuring the carbon impact of what we eat, which looks interesting.

https://www.vegansociety.com/take-action/campaigns/plate-planet

Gassho
Meitou
sattodaylah

[Shoka]

Hey everyone,

One thing that I do which I think relates to Eco Living is having a garden. We are lucky and have a community garden, so we have about 300 sq. ft. to grow whatever we want. This is our 5th growing season, but we learn something new every year.

The first year, we had a horrible time and produced almost nothing. Which was eye opening to how much work goes into getting those veggies that we pick-up so easily at the grocery store. But it also meant we really cherished the little bit we were able to produce and enjoy. Because we are in a community garden, we have garden neighbors who often shared produce with us and knowledge for the next year.

The second year, we did much better. I was able to get a lot of basil to grow, arugula and a strange type of kale did really well. I made pesto out of the basil and gave it away to friends and family. Kale and arugula became a standard side salad. And we started to be good with eating leaves that had a small insect hole here and there. It also changed how I looked at picking fruits and vegetables at the store, I wasn't so worried about getting the "perfect" ones. And I was much more willing to eat them after they started to wilt a little or had a small bad spot that might need to be cut off.

Our third year was all about tomatoes because my guy loves tomatoes. That year I learned how to can tomato sauce as we had so many tomatoes that we couldn't keep up with using them or giving them away. We also got eggplants to grow, and some Japanese cucumbers. We learned to eat the veggies that would grow well in the garden... like eggplants which I never buy at the grocery store.

Last year that garden did amazingly! We had more produce than we knew what to do with. I had zucchini coming out of our ears, tomatoes for days, and lettuce for as many salads as we wanted. Every few days I would go and harvest; give away whatever was too much for us. And tried to use as much of the rest as we could. Last year was all about sharing with others and using everything we could.

After several seasons I definitely have a different respect for being able to buy some vegetables year round, like bell peppers. (Still haven't gotten those to grow well in the garden). I also really appreciate the amount of time and work that goes into the food that is on my table (especially if I haven't grown it).

Lastly, I've learned a lot about food waste. I was shocked with how much produce from our garden would go bad, or how much lettuce would be picked and tossed aside. To that end I started researching which leaves are editable and often make odd things like radish and beet leaf salads to minimize waste as much as possible.

Even if you don't have access to a big garden, it is surprising how much I have seen people grow in small places and even pots. Even just one herb pot that you love to cook with or use in the house.

I am often surprised by how wonderful a teacher the gardening can be.

Gassho,

Shoka
sattoday

[Kotei]

Thank you Shoka, that sounds very rewarding (and work intensive).

Gardening over here is more on the ornamental side, but I am growing some tomatoes, peppers, zucchini in large pots on the terrace.
A friend round the corner grows potatoes on a slightly larger scale and if you commit to picking potato beetles and help here and there, you can dig some up instead of buying them in the store.

Regarding the veggie food waste, I am using a worm composter, consisting of large, stacked sieves (and compost worms, of course).
The resulting earth and 'worm-tea' are the best fertiliser, I know (containing only few nitrogen and lots of Mg/K/Ca/microorganisms etc.)
With your larger scale, that would probably be more on the traditional compost heap side, but the resulting fertiliser is of course the same.

Gassho,
Kotei sat/lah today.