Sept 9th-10th, 2016 - OUR MONTHLY 4-hour ZAZENKAI - COMMENCING this ANGO & JUKAI !

[martyrob]

Thank you all.
When I walk the dogs later I will pick up their poo with new found reverence.

Wishing all well,
Martyn


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[Jundo]

Though, I have a question:

When you mentioned Not Killing and how it relates to unintended civilian casualties on the battlefield, I've been wondering how to reconcile the two. It is difficult to recognize that this is, as you say, no accident. It seems if one is to learn from this non-accident (to which you alluded in the sewing example), that it is quite the hefty price paid for me to learn a lesson. Perhaps I have a flawed understanding of your meaning. Should I view this in a different way? Is there nothing to understand? Is my question better suited for another thread? I was hoping you might be able to elaborate a little bit. Thanks! Oh, and yes, war is stupid.

Deep Bows

Gassho
Eric

#ST

Hi Eric,

Would you do me a favor and ask again in a few weeks, when we look at the Precept on Avoiding Taking Life during our Jukai Preparations?

I will say now that there are no easy answers to this. Sometimes military action may be needed to preserve innocent life. Nishijima Roshi (and the Dalai Lama too if one listens closely) have said that sometimes military action is needed to protect democratic society, however imperfect it is. But that means that, in doing so, innocent lives will always be taken. It is a terrible situation.

I have known cases in law enforcement of someone who accidently took an innocent life in an attempt to save life. I have known soldiers who have faced such a hell. Even if the shooting is officially later justified, each and all carry the weight of what they have done all their lives. I wrote this to someone who faced such a tragedy in Bosnia ...

Unfortunately, I know too many veterans from various wars and police officers ... some close friends and family ... who can share like tales of being involved in innocents, children, killed in the heat of combat. They all carry scars, and will do so forever. Even those who believe it was unavoidable feel the weight. Such is the weight of Karma.

I long ... I foresee ... a world in which our capability to do violence against each other has been evolved past. There will be a world without wars and violence.

But for now, I do feel that some wars ... although tragic ... are needed to preserve life and society (which is also a way of preserving life). Having had my own relatives die in the Holocaust during WWII (Jews in Poland, my grandparents' family although I did not know them), I believe that some wars may be necessary to fight true evil. On the other hand, they must be avoided at every cost, and some wars ... over nationalism, religion, land which all could share ... are not excusable.

I believe that you were there as a peace-keeper, a Bodhisattva's mission. You were protecting innocents. In the heat of the moment, an innocent was killed. It is tragic, it is something to carry always. It also may have been unavoidable in the circumstances, an accident on a terrible peace-keeping mission. It is my belief that one is truly not liable ... in society's law or Buddha Law ... for unintended actions short of true recklessness. Nonetheless, accident or not, we feel the weight of what was done.

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?10791-Perspectives-on-Non-Violence&p=99398&viewfull=1#post99398

I am not sure about the effect of our Karma in lives to come ... but I do know that we likely will bear the effects of our actions in this life in some way. I have a friend, an ex-policeman, who had to kill someone in a perfectly necessary and justified act to save lives. Yet, my friend still carries that with him to this day. I have ex-military friends who are Buddhists (Rev. Daiho Hilbert is one) who still carry the weight of having taken life (in Daiho's case, he killed someone in a "friendly fire" incident in Vietnam as well as unknown numbers of opposing troops ... all sentient beings doing what they were told).

No, taking lives is never a "good" thing. Sometimes it is necessary.


Gassho, with sadness, J

SatToday

[Aeriqual]

Jundo,

Thank you for your response. I would be happy to ask this question later during precept discussion. Ultimately, I would like to be at a place where I might bring understanding and closure to those in similar situations. Or at least just offer my presence. Thanks again!

Gassho
Eric

#ST


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[Byokan]

Wonderful, thank you dear Sangha!

Gassho
Byōkan
sat today

[Kyosei]

Jundo,

I sat with the recorded Zazenkai, thank you so much for that Dharma Talk. Very inspiring. Thanks for the teachings on the Koans (and for pointing us that altough we should neither be too loose nor too tight in our practice, we oughta better practice)

Very cool to see you speaking japanese!

May I ask a question: when "we" set our objectives for the Ango session, (presuming we are doing it wholeheartedly, not trying to "compete" for "approval of the teacher", for attention, etc. with someone's else's objectives) why do we do that (in Ango)? Is there a historical or traditional background for that?

And: Do these compromises comes from our True Self (as we know they almost represents sacrifices for us)? Is that because we intimately already "know" what we need to improve or "open hand of" to "cut the edges" and "shine our diamonds" (I remembered Pink Floyd's "Shine On You Crazy Diamond",lol.) to express our True Selves more vast and openly? Hope you understood what I tried to convey.

Thank you.

Gassho

[Kyosei]

May I ask one more question?

Is everything (even stinky things, lol) the Buddha only when we perceive we are really not separated from it?

I remember something I read - maybe a Koan - when Bodhidharma says "not sacred", I guess it is one of the responses he gives to Emperor Wu:

"(...)Emperor Wu, a little put out: "What then is the most important principle of Buddhism?"

Bodhidharma: "Vast emptiness. Nothing sacred.""

as seenhere.

What does he meant by "Nothing sacred" if everything is Buddha, if Buddha-nature pervades all? Does he said that because the emperor were conceptualizing?

Gassho.

[Jundo]

May I ask a question: when "we" set our objectives for the Ango session, (presuming we are doing it wholeheartedly, not trying to "compete" for "approval of the teacher", for attention, etc. with someone's else's objectives) why do we do that (in Ango)? Is there a historical or traditional background for that?

Hi Marcos,

If I understand your question, Ango was the time in India when the monks would gather to Practice together during the rainy season when travel was impossible. It became, in China and Japan and elsewhere, a time to gather for a bit more intensive group Practice, basically an extended Sesshin.

There is "nothing to attain" in this Practice, but sometimes we need to work a bit more intensively and seriously ... wrestling with our me myself and i ... to attain what this "nothing to attain" is all about.

And: Do these compromises comes from our True Self (as we know they almost represents sacrifices for us)? Is that because we intimately already "know" what we need to improve or "open hand of" to "cut the edges" and "shine our diamonds" (I remembered Pink Floyd's "Shine On You Crazy Diamond",lol.) to express our True Selves more vast and openly? Hope you understood what I tried to convey.

Frankly, I understand the lyrics to Pink Floyd's Animals more. I will let you figure all this out or, better, drop it aside and just Ango.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Sekishi]

Bodhidharma: "Vast emptiness. Nothing sacred.""

as seenhere.

What does he meant by "Nothing sacred" if everything is Buddha, if Buddha-nature pervades all? Does he said that because the emperor were conceptualizing?

I am a junior around here, so take this with a grain of salt, but I have three questions on this for you:

1. If it could have been stated more clearly, Bodhidharma would have done so. Why didn't he use more words?
2. Few teachings are absolutes. Bodhidharma was responding to Emperor Wu. What is "sacred" to someone who built many Buddhist temples (and destroyed many Taoist temples) in a bid for merit?
3. If we sit and connect personally with "vast emptiness", what thing can be grasped that is sacred?

But again, take that with a chunk 'o salt.

Deep bows,
Sekishi

[Kyosei]

I am a junior around here, so take this with a grain of salt, but I have three questions on this for you:

1. If it could have been stated more clearly, Bodhidharma would have done so. Why didn't he use more words?
2. Few teachings are absolutes. Bodhidharma was responding to Emperor Wu. What is "sacred" to someone who built many Buddhist temples (and destroyed many Taoist temples) in a bid for merit?
3. If we sit and connect personally with "vast emptiness", what thing can be grasped that is sacred?

But again, take that with a chunk 'o salt.

Deep bows,
Sekishi

Gassho, Sekishi. A bow. I'll sit with that. Thank you so much.

[Kyosei]

Hi Marcos,

If I understand your question, Ango was the time in India when the monks would gather to Practice together during the rainy season when travel was impossible. It became, in China and Japan and elsewhere, a time to gather for a bit more intensive group Practice, basically an extended Sesshin.

There is "nothing to attain" in this Practice, but sometimes we need to work a bit more intensively and seriously ... wrestling with our me myself and i ... to attain what this "nothing to attain" is all about.



Frankly, I understand the lyrics to Pink Floyd's Animals more. I will let you figure all this out or, better, drop it aside and just Ango.

Gassho, J

SatToday

Gassho Jundo. Thank you.

[Kaishin]

Thank you, everyone. Enjoy your Ango.

-satToday

[Kyonin]

What does he meant by "Nothing sacred" if everything is Buddha, if Buddha-nature pervades all? Does he said that because the emperor were conceptualizing

Hi Marcos,

Nothing sacred for me is that everything is sacred! In fact, everything is so sacred that since all is in the same leven of sacredness, we fail to see it!

But we can realize this with a still mind and with a steady practice.

But I may be wrong

Gassho,

Kyonin
#SatToday

[Shokai]

But we can realize this with a still mind and with a steady practice.

But I may be wrong

actually, i think you were right on



When in doubt, just sit

[Hoko]

It took a few bites but I finished sitting zazenkai with you all.
Thank you, Jundo; I enjoyed your talk and thought you did a very good job bringing the koans to life.
I wish everyone the best in their Ango efforts!
Gassho,
K2
#SatToday

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[Kokuu]

Thank you all! A lovely way to start Ango!

Gassho
Kokuu
#sattoday