Lost in zazen (or, as the pixies would say, "where is my mind")

[Judith del Carmen]

Bodhidharma sits facing the wall. His future successor stands in the snow and presents his severed arm to Bodhidharma. He cries: "My mind is not pacified. Master, pacify my mind."

Bodhidharma says: "If you bring me that mind, I will pacify it for you."

The successor says: "When I search my mind I cannot hold it."

Bodhidharma says: "Then your mind is pacified already."

Beautiful.

Interesting discussion, thank you all for your wisdom.
Gassho
Sat today

[Jundo]

The successor says: "When I search my mind I cannot hold it."

Oh, I like this translation (usually it is "cannot find it").

(Apparently it is from a 1934 version of the Mumonkan Gateless Gate by Nyogen Senzaki Roshi and Paul Reps)

Thank you.

Gassho, J

SatToday

PS - Sorry, translators always need to look ...

祖云、覓心了不可得

The main Kanji is 得 ... In modern Chinese and Japanese "to obtain / to get / to gain / to catch". Yep, it works!

[Jeremy]

Hi Uggy,

If you want to stick with Zazen, you might like this: http://antaiji.org/en/services/%E3%8...D%A3%E8%91%97/

I nearly posted this link during your previous thread about dropping body and mind - there's a nice easy-going section about dropping body and mind towards the end.

Step lightly, stay free,
Jeremy
SatToday

[Joyo]

Bodhidharma sits facing the wall. His future successor stands in the snow and presents his severed arm to Bodhidharma. He cries: "My mind is not pacified. Master, pacify my mind."

Bodhidharma says: "If you bring me that mind, I will pacify it for you."

The successor says: "When I search my mind I cannot hold it."

Bodhidharma says: "Then your mind is pacified already."

Beautiful.

Interesting discussion, thank you all for your wisdom.
Gassho
Sat today

Thank you for the interesting and thought-provoking teaching.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

[Tairin]

Hi Uggy,

If you want to stick with Zazen, you might like this: http://antaiji.org/en/services/%E3%8...D%A3%E8%91%97/

I nearly posted this link during your previous thread about dropping body and mind - there's a nice easy-going section about dropping body and mind towards the end.

Step lightly, stay free,
Jeremy
SatToday

Hi Jeremy

This was fantastic. Thank you for this pointer. So clear and really resonated with me.

Gassho
Warren
Sat today

[Ugrok]

Thanks a lot.

Thanks to your advices, i felt incredible peace in zazen this morning. Incredible ! I just let everything go, i trusted everything, it was like "okay, everything i think or feel is there for a reason, so let it all flow as it is and TRUST zazen". I dropped everything and did nothing at all to stop anything, even my internal struggles. The thoughts that scared me, i let them be ALL as long as they wanted. I let my body do whatever it wanted. After a bit of discomfort, it was like everything came into me (hard to explain really), fully integrated, there was no struggle AT ALL anymore from my part, i almost cried with relief as i could feel my body and mind thanking me for it !

I understood what i did wrong : i thought that i knew better. I thought that i knew how life should be and i resisted everything that came up in zazen... Well it's the other way around : life knows better, zazen knows better, our body and mind are perfect things that know perfectly well how to take care of themselves if we let them be as they are... It's so difficult to see that, because i really thought I was in charge, I had to decide how it should be, and if not i suffered. And this very suffering made me think that it was wrong and that i should get rid of it. And this kept me suffering even more. It's a vicious cycle, which is hard to break, because the more you try to break it, the more it closes.

Now, to forget that experience of peace and keep practicing.

Thanks again,

Gassho,

Uggy
Sat Today

[Jakuden]

Yay Uggy! Thank you for this thread and for everyone's contributions

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday

[Jakuden]

I love these passages from the article Jeremy linked:

"Some people begin with the practice of shikantaza and then give it up quickly because it does not give them that feeling of fullness or because it bores them. They do so because they only understand this awakening a billion times in their heads. That’s why they think, “Oh no! I have to awaken the mind a billion times? What I need is satori! If I hurry up and get one big satori, I can wrap up this billion-times business in a single stroke!”

It is exactly as if we were told as babies, “From now on you will have to breathe, your whole life long, this very breath, again and again, every single moment. You will breathe in and breathe out billions of times.” What baby would say, “Oh no! I’ve got to find some way to take care of these billion breaths once and for all, with one really big breath…”? Even if we tried, we would not succeed...
....People who try to get one big satori do not accept that they must live their life with all of its freshness and vigor. Even in strictly biological terms, we can only live by taking this breath in this moment. Living means breathing this breath right now. When it is a matter of living this fresh life, it is of course not enough to simply think about your life in your head. Instead we have got to accept it as the vigorous life that it is. Only like this will we discover an attitude and posture which is fresh and vigorous."

I see stress, anxiety and boredom all around in this culture. Kids are anxious and overwhelmed; they are promised Santa Claus and Prince Charming and Happily Ever After as babies, and then they find out that really life is obligations and repetition and often pushing through fatigue, day after day. Young people move from job to job, looking for their "dream job." We fix meals and clean house and raise children and work, and wonder why it isn't as glorious and exciting as it is in all the movies and TV we watch (or on other peoples' Facebook pages). Sometimes we even get bored in this forum with the same topics raised over and over! So our only chance to escape from the suffering is to awaken a billion times over, every moment, just like we breathe in our lives a billion times over. Practice never ends.

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday

[Joyo]

I see stress, anxiety and boredom all around in this culture. Kids are anxious and overwhelmed; they are promised Santa Claus and Prince Charming and Happily Ever After as babies, and then they find out that really life is obligations and repetition and often pushing through fatigue, day after day. Young people move from job to job, looking for their "dream job." We fix meals and clean house and raise children and work, and wonder why it isn't as glorious and exciting as it is in all the movies and TV we watch (or on other peoples' Facebook pages). Sometimes we even get bored in this forum with the same topics raised over and over! So our only chance to escape from the suffering is to awaken a billion times over, every moment, just like we breathe in our lives a billion times over. Practice never ends.

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday

What you said here reminded me of this article. I cam across it a few weeks ago and it has really changed my perspective on everything, including zazen.

http://www.alifeinprogress.ca/want-mediocre-life/

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

[Jakuden]

What you said here reminded me of this article. I cam across it a few weeks ago and it has really changed my perspective on everything, including zazen.

http://www.alifeinprogress.ca/want-mediocre-life/

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

Wow Joyo, yes! To embrace and embody the Middle Way. How freeing.
Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Joyo]

Wow Joyo, yes! To embrace and embody the Middle Way. How freeing.
Gassho
Jakuden
SatToday


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

After reading this, every time I am dissatisfied with something I remind myself of the mediocre life. It makes me more grateful and content.

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

[Jundo]

What you said here reminded me of this article. I cam across it a few weeks ago and it has really changed my perspective on everything, including zazen.

http://www.alifeinprogress.ca/want-mediocre-life/

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

That is a wonderful wise article. Simple, one's own pace, appreciative, Middle Way.

We should have media networks that, instead of broadcasting the "beautiful people" doing the next shiny latest gotta stand out thing, just have beautifully ordinary people doing daily lovely life things.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Mp]

What you said here reminded me of this article. I cam across it a few weeks ago and it has really changed my perspective on everything, including zazen.

http://www.alifeinprogress.ca/want-mediocre-life/

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

Thank you for this share Joyo, I too very much liked this article ... a simple, mediocre life sounds good to me too. =)

Gassho
Shingen

s@today

[Taiyo]

What you said here reminded me of this article. I cam across it a few weeks ago and it has really changed my perspective on everything, including zazen.

http://www.alifeinprogress.ca/want-mediocre-life/

Gassho,
Joyo
sat today

I just loved the article. Thanks for sharing it, Joyo

Such a beautiful Middle Way!

Gassho,
Taiyo

SatToday

[Jundo]

Thanks a lot.

Thanks to your advices, i felt incredible peace in zazen this morning. Incredible ! I just let everything go, i trusted everything, it was like "okay, everything i think or feel is there for a reason, so let it all flow as it is and TRUST zazen". I dropped everything and did nothing at all to stop anything, even my internal struggles. The thoughts that scared me, i let them be ALL as long as they wanted. I let my body do whatever it wanted. After a bit of discomfort, it was like everything came into me (hard to explain really), fully integrated, there was no struggle AT ALL anymore from my part, i almost cried with relief as i could feel my body and mind thanking me for it !

Lovely! It sounds as if you have trouble pierced an aspect of the non-resistance of Zazen. Bravo.

And this too shall pass! Do not demand or resist if Zazen and life are not so smooth each day. Remember that Zazen changes each day, and that the Moon is always shining on both clear days and when hidden by the clouds. Zazen is the Peace so Peaceful that it sometimes feels peaceful, and sometimes not. The best days perhaps is when moon shines though and illuminates the clouds. All days, clear or cloudy, "Good Zazen."

Gassho, J

SatToday