I just posted this at the Soto Zen Facebook group. I thought to get it off my chest here too. It was in response to a student who is feeling a little off about his unnamed teacher, and can't get what the teacher says ... (I reprint here because publicly posted) ...
I wrote ...
Some Zen folks say weird stuff because, well, the "logic" of Zen, Huayan and much of the rest of the Mahayana is not our ordinary logic (e,g, for us "when Charles catches cold, Mary sneezes" means something like the Beatles "I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together" and actually makes sense beyond ordinary sense!) Sometimes, we try to say things beyond words to express the inexpressible ... so all that drawing Enso circles in the air and MUing. Sometimes someone like Dogen said wild stuff because he believed in the power of certain words and images as turning words ... that the words were not only "the finger pointing at the moon" but that the moon was shining forth from the very finger tip itself.
And sometimes, too frequently, some Zen teachers (and other experienced folks who should know better) talk total obscure bullshit and psyho-babble because they don't have clarity themselves and say such weird stream of consciousness new agey Koany clapdoodle to cover their tracks or because they feel that just saying that kind of thing is Truth (I can point out any number of podcasts and essays from some surprising sources I will not name, and a fool is born every minute. Sometimes a robe and a little charm cover up many failings. But let me just say that if someone is saying weird wacko stuff about a Koan ... sometimes it is wise and sometimes it is just weird wacko,).
Nobody can tell you about your own Teacher. In fact, some of the problem may just be lack of chemical resonance between Teacher and student and, what is helpful and insightful for student A can't be fathomed by student B. . Also, how you feel today may not be how you feel next week or next year (like a marriage or any relationship that way).
In the end, as many wise teachers say, the teacher is not to tell you anything, and just point the way (moon and finger). You need to do your own heavy lifting. Also, sometimes the most imperfect teachers are the best. Why? They help us get past the need for perfection in all things, which is a BIG important lesson of our Way. Coo coo cachoo.
Gassho, J
SatToday
My teacher seems to often dodge, avoid or otherwise ignore many of my questions. He usually punctuates this with a sly smile, as if to say "There's more to my silence than a simple inability to answer your question"; suffice to say, I am beginning to think about 70% of what he says is bullsh*t. Is this all my own projection and neuroses? I know that the relative truth of the concepts we're working with can only take us so far [towards the absolute] but what can/should I expect from my teacher in this regard?
Some Zen folks say weird stuff because, well, the "logic" of Zen, Huayan and much of the rest of the Mahayana is not our ordinary logic (e,g, for us "when Charles catches cold, Mary sneezes" means something like the Beatles "I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together" and actually makes sense beyond ordinary sense!) Sometimes, we try to say things beyond words to express the inexpressible ... so all that drawing Enso circles in the air and MUing. Sometimes someone like Dogen said wild stuff because he believed in the power of certain words and images as turning words ... that the words were not only "the finger pointing at the moon" but that the moon was shining forth from the very finger tip itself.
And sometimes, too frequently, some Zen teachers (and other experienced folks who should know better) talk total obscure bullshit and psyho-babble because they don't have clarity themselves and say such weird stream of consciousness new agey Koany clapdoodle to cover their tracks or because they feel that just saying that kind of thing is Truth (I can point out any number of podcasts and essays from some surprising sources I will not name, and a fool is born every minute. Sometimes a robe and a little charm cover up many failings. But let me just say that if someone is saying weird wacko stuff about a Koan ... sometimes it is wise and sometimes it is just weird wacko,).
Nobody can tell you about your own Teacher. In fact, some of the problem may just be lack of chemical resonance between Teacher and student and, what is helpful and insightful for student A can't be fathomed by student B. . Also, how you feel today may not be how you feel next week or next year (like a marriage or any relationship that way).
In the end, as many wise teachers say, the teacher is not to tell you anything, and just point the way (moon and finger). You need to do your own heavy lifting. Also, sometimes the most imperfect teachers are the best. Why? They help us get past the need for perfection in all things, which is a BIG important lesson of our Way. Coo coo cachoo.
Gassho, J
SatToday
), I respond differently to different styles. As I've become more experienced, I tried to recognize that teaching and learning are "not two." It's funny, but, as I've begun to study Zen more seriously, I have developed great compassion for my students and their frustration with me and the material; I only wish that they would respond to that frustration more productively, which seems to be at the heart of the OP that you responded to: how do we respond to the frustration of the learning experience, especially when that experience has us wandering in very alien territory, driven only by a desire to understand. This is where the teacher-student relationship reaches its limits: ultimately, learning is up to the student. Too often students sit back--or even earnestly work--and want to be told what their supposed to know or do or understand without realizing that HOW they learn is the most important part of learning, and that is the one thing a teacher can't teach. It reminds me of the story (I forget all the details) about the young monk who approaches his teacher and asks about the secret of the Tao. The teacher responds, "I would love to tell you, but right now, I have to relieve myself. It's such a small thing, and yet I must do it myself. Can you do it for me?" It's a messy, inconvenient, and frustrating task, and yet, we must do it (learn) ourselves.
) Everyone just wants to "do their own thing", make their own practices and rituals and altars ... choose those practices from the dessert line of the "Buddhist cafeteria" which they find tasty, and leave the bitter spinach practices. The result is -- sometimes -- a great looseness and confusion, a kind of "spiritual materialism" teaching/teacher shopping for fashions and styles that are personally pleasing (not to be confused with finding the medicine among medicines which one truly needs ... a kind of positive "teacher/teaching shopping").
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