TNH and the Heart Sutra

[Nameless]

Just picked up the Heart of Understanding by TNH. It's his commentary on the Heart Sutra and I've gotta say... it's brilliant and touching. Cry at least once each time I read it (three times now since it's only 50 pages). In one chapter, he encourages us to ask if something is empty, then what is it empty of? Something isn't just empty, it's empty of something, and that something is a separate, permanent self. Nothing and no one exists alone. Because I am, you are, because you are, everything is. "Empty of a separate self means full of everything." Knowing this intellectually isn't enough. We have to fully experience impermanence and interbeing firsthand via meditation and mindfulness:

"If you are a poet, you will see clearly that there is a cloud floating in this sheet of paper. Without a cloud, there could be no rain, without rain, the trees cannot grow; and without trees, we cannot make paper. The cloud is essential for the paper to exist. If the cloud is not here, the sheet of paper cannot be here either. So we can say that the cloud and the paper inter-are (interbeing)...

If we look into this sheet of paper even more deeply, we can see the sunshine in it. If the sunshine is not there, the forest cannot grow. In fact, nothing can grow. Even we cannot grow without sunshine. And so, we know that the sunshine is also in this sheet of paper. The paper and the sunshine inter-are. And if we continue to look, we can see the logger who cut the tree and brought it to the mill to be transformed into paper. And we see the wheat. We know that the logger cannot exist without his daily bread, and therefore the wheat that became his bread is also in this sheet of paper. And the logger's father and mother are in it too. When we look in this way, we see that without all of these things, the sheet of paper cannot exist.

Looking more deeply, we can see that we are in it too. This is not difficult to see, because when we look at a sheet of paper, the sheet of paper is part of our perception. Your mind is in here and mine is also. So we can say that everything is in here in this sheet of paper. You cannot point out one thing that is not here - time, space, the earth, the rain, the minerals in the soil, the sunshine, the cloud, the river, the heat. Everything coexists with this sheet of paper...

You cannot just be by yourself alone. You have to inter-be with every other thing. This sheet of paper is, because everything is.. The fact is that this sheet of paper is made up of 'non-paper elements.' And if we return these non-paper elements to their sources, then there can be no paper at all. As thin as this sheet of paper is, it contains everything in the universe."

Gassho, John

[Heishu]

Hello John,

Thank you for this, I liked what you said. I read the Heart of Understanding a while back and I agree with you on this teaching by TNH. This oneness with the universe, so vast and yet so small.

Gassho,
Heishu

[pinoybuddhist]

Had a conversaton with my wife over breakfast yesterday where we started from my first aikido teacher's vegetarianism (a worthy path, but not for either of us) and ended up as a sharing of our views on our interbeing with food (though we didn't quite word it that way). My wife's a typical japanese of her generation so she's not really into all this Zen and Buddhism stuff, but showing gratitude for the meal through doing gassho and saying "Itadakimasu" - roughly means "I will eat" but carries a connotation of respect - is a big deal for her because we have to eat to live, and (I pointed out, to which she agreed) we can only eat what used to be alive. I mean, the soil itself on which the plants take root is made of the decayed bodies of dead living things... the food comes from the universe, is on our plates because of the universe. And that goes for everything - food, paper, you, me...

Gassho,
Raf

[Jishin]

I loved the book too John.

Gassho, Jishin

[Jinyo]

Hello John - it is a lovely book and a good example of TNH using skillfull means to communicate a fundamental
teaching of buddhism.

But I also value Red Pine's translation and commentary as it puts flesh on some bare bones of the wider context - which I found helpful.

Gassho

Willow

[Jundo]

I love TNH's presentation and quote the "paper and sun" story many times.

If there is one criticism, some folks have found TNH's presentation to sometimes be too materialistic, in the sense of being limited in the things he lists to observable physical objects and living beings, matter and energy of the world. Also, there is not a sense of the wondrous interflowing wholeness of emptiness. Perhaps we need to add something like, "and the paper is all things ... and not things ... beyond and right through that, known and unknown, and each is all and each is the other through and through".

Something (and not thing) like that.

Gassho, J

[Jishin]

TNH and the Heart Sutra

Jundo,

I think below is the Treeleaf Heart Sutra. At first it says emptiness is precisely form but then it says it's not. How come?

Gassho, Jishin

Treeleaf
HEART SUTRA
Avolokitesvara Bodhisattva, Awakened One of Compassion
In Prajna Paramita, the Deep Practice of Perfect Wisdom*
Perceived the emptiness of all five conditions,
And was free of suffering.
O Shariputra, form is no other than emptiness,
Emptiness no other than form;
Form is precisely emptiness, emptiness precisely form.
Sensations, perceptions, formations and consciousness are also like this.
O Shariputra, all things are expressions of emptiness,
Not born, not destroyed, not stained, not pure;
Neither waxing nor waning.
Thus emptiness is not form; not sensation nor perception,
not formation nor consciousness.
No eye, ear, nose, tongue, body, mind;
No sight, sound, smell, taste, touch, nor object of mind;
No realm of sight, no realm of consciousness;
No ignorance, no end to ignorance;
No old age and death,
No cessation of old age and death;
No suffering, nor cause or end to suffering;
No path, no wisdom and no gain.
No gain – thus Boddhisattvas live this Prajna Paramita*
With no hindrance of mind –
No hindrance therefore no fear.
Far beyond all delusion, Nirvana is already here.
All past, present and future Buddhas
Live this Prajna Paramita*
And realize supreme and complete enlightenment.
Therefore know that Prajna Paramita
Is the sacred mantra, the luminous mantra,
the supreme mantra, the incomparable mantra
by which all suffering is clear.
This is no other than Truth.
Therefore set forth the Prajna Paramita mantra.
Set forth this mantra and proclaim:*
(1x)
Gate! Gate! (Already Gone, Gone)
Paragate! (Already Gone Beyond)
Parasamgate! (Already Fully Beyond)
Bodhi! Svaha! * (Awakening, Rejoice)

[pinoybuddhist]

It is and it isn't.

[Jishin]

It is and it isn't.

Thanks.

Gassho, Jishin

[Risho]

Thank you Jishin. Awesome Question!!! OK.. I'm going to attempt to answer this knowing full well that I will fail, but I will attempt to answer this because it's such an awesome question and it must be asked again and again knowing full well that the answer changes and the only answer is to drop all this and practice. This could be one of the most important questions in our practice, and I mean honestly I have to sit more, but I think it's something really important that we need to investigate. There are so many things we do in this wonderful practice, and every one of them should be questioned.

In the precepts we are studying the 3 pure precepts. The Heart Sutra is a way of looking at the precepts. To paraphrase: Cease all evil. Practice Good. Do good for others (save others).

There are others to save, but there are no others, simultaneously. By helping ourselves, finding balance and stability, we are saving others. But we can't just sit on our butts thinking that's saving others. There's a fine balance of falling to one side or the other. The middle path is deceptively simple, but it's incredibly difficult.. That's why we practice.

In Shikantaza, when you are fully "here", then you slip off into a dream or thought. That's the falling to one side or the other. But our practice is to just keep falling and just keep getting up. Just keep getting up. Never quit. After all, this isn't about you at all, but only you can do it.

We are all the same, but we are all different, each in our own place and time. To steal from John Daido Loori, you and I are the same, but you are not me, and I am not you.

We are connected in ways that we cannot intellectually fathom, yet intellect is a gateway to practice.

I love TNH's commentary because he focuses on that interconnectedness; I never thought about it like Jundo said that it could be too materialistic. Interesting.. I just never thought of that.

Emptiness as I understand it, is that things are all empty of an independent self. We can only define things by virtue of their relationship to other things (i.e. relatively)... they are this high, as opposed to that high. They are brown, or they are white... All these descriptions are in fact expressing the relationship to everything else. Without you, there couldn't be anything else.

So in a way you are the center of the universe. But the rub is that so am I, and so is Willow and so is Kyonin, etc.

And these are just words.. and I have a bad habit of making things too intellectual, but ultimately with true practice this is a very very compassionate and loving practice. This form is emptiness and emptiness is form is the essence because it means that we are connected, and that our normal way of looking at things is ass-backward. That by following our normal motivations of greed, anger and ignorance we are destroying ourselves. When you hurt someone, it takes a massive psychological toll. I mean after practicing for a couple of years now, for example, after getting really furious I feel it within my body. It drains me. Greed or jealousy at "others" drains me.. because "others" are me.

But I can't just live in your house or drive your car because "Emptiness is not Form" at the same time. You are you and I am me. It's really just beautiful.

And this is practice. Why do you sit zen? Why do I sit zen? Why do I do this seemingly crazy practice? Why do I say the bodhisattva vows? Why participate in Ango? Why have Sangha? Why sew the Rakusu? It's all here. This is a sane way to live. These are the questions that are just integral to this practice.

Zen is useless, but it's also the most important thing we can do, discovering who we are... not limiting ourselves to these bullshit definitions of our roles in life. Sure our roles are real to some extent.. we are Dads, Moms, husbands, wives, students, etc., but we are also so much more than a definition could ever hope to describe.

When I started this practice I wasn't sure why. I was feeling stressed. I wanted to be more compassionate whatever that meant. Those definitions limit Zen. Practice is beyond form and emptiness. It is limitless.

The world is on fire. The media would have us believe we are on the brink of World War III. Greed, anger and ignorance. At the same time, when someone cuts us off in traffic, we want to kill them or beat them or hurt them. There is World War 3. So those crazy bastards that want to nuke us are us. At the same time, we are ourselves and we need to take responsibility for our own actions.. to atone and to have the courage to face those harmful actions, not feel ashamed, not feed them. Learn from them, let them dissipate. That is practice man.

Gassho,

Risho

[Jundo]

It is and it isn't.

And it is neither is nor isn't. And more but just precisely all that.

Now ... GO SIT!

We live in a world of apparently separate things and beings ...

... except that, for another non-perspective, there are no separate things or beings ...

... and yet, something more than that, yet all that too.

So ...GO SIT!

Gassho, J

[Daiyo]

And this is practice. Why do you sit zen? Why do I sit zen? Why do I do this seemingly crazy practice? Why do I say the bodhisattva vows? Why participate in Ango? Why have Sangha? Why sew the Rakusu? It's all here. This is a sane way to live. These are the questions that are just integral to this practice.

Zen is useless, but it's also the most important thing we can do, discovering who we are... not limiting ourselves to these bullshit definitions of our roles in life. Sure our roles are real to some extent.. we are Dads, Moms, husbands, wives, students, etc., but we are also so much more than a definition could ever hope to describe.

When I started this practice I wasn't sure why. I was feeling stressed. I wanted to be more compassionate whatever that meant. Those definitions limit Zen. Practice is beyond form and emptiness. It is limitless.

The world is on fire. The media would have us believe we are on the brink of World War III. Greed, anger and ignorance. At the same time, when someone cuts us off in traffic, we want to kill them or beat them or hurt them. There is World War 3. So those crazy bastards that want to nuke us are us. At the same time, we are ourselves and we need to take responsibility for our own actions.. to atone and to have the courage to face those harmful actions, not feel ashamed, not feed them. Learn from them, let them dissipate. That is practice man.

Gassho,

Risho

Thanks Risho, I felt very identified with your words.
Awesome words, BTW.

I am walking the part of the road where I am not sure why I do practice. I started some time ago because I was feeling stressed, wanted to be more compassionate.
I still don't know how to define in words why I practice, but I feel doing this is doing good. To me and others (no two, as you guys like to emphasize)
In a short time, continued practice made me less egotistic, angry, jealous, greedy.

Thanks everyone for your practice.

Gassho,
Walter.

[Risho]

And it is neither is nor isn't. And more but just precisely all that.

Now ... GO SIT!

We live in a world of apparently separate things and beings ...

... except that, for another non-perspective, there are no separate things or beings ...

... and yet, something more than that, yet all that too.

So ...GO SIT!

Gassho, J

[Kyonin]

And it is neither is nor isn't. And more but just precisely all that.

Now ... GO SIT!

We live in a world of apparently separate things and beings ...

... except that, for another non-perspective, there are no separate things or beings ...

... and yet, something more than that, yet all that too.

So ...GO SIT!

Gassho, J

Yes, reading and studying the Heart Sutra will only take you so far. Sitting zazen is how it all makes sense. And the fun part is that every time something new pops up, just to wash away in the waves of the mind.

Ok, now I'll go sit.

Gassho,

Kyonin

[pinoybuddhist]

And it is neither is nor isn't. And more but just precisely all that.

Now ... GO SIT!

We live in a world of apparently separate things and beings ...

... except that, for another non-perspective, there are no separate things or beings ...

... and yet, something more than that, yet all that too.

So ...GO SIT!

Gassho, J

Yes, reading and studying the Heart Sutra will only take you so far. Sitting zazen is how it all makes sense. And the fun part is that every time something new pops up, just to wash away in the waves of the mind.

Ok, now I'll go sit.

Gassho,

Kyonin

Gassho,
Raf