Dukkha = frustration?

[Ryumon]

I've been reading a book called Missing Out: In Praise of the Unlived Life by Adam Phillips, who is a psychoanalyst. He talks about "frustration," and the way he describes makes a good parallel with dukkha:


"there are (at least) four kinds of frustration: the frustration of being deprived of something that has never existed; the frustration of being deprived of something one has never had (whether or not it exists); the frustration of being deprived of something one has had; and, finally, the frustration of being deprived of something one once had, but can’t have again."

Gassho,

Kirk

[Myosha]

Hello,

Whomever this 'being' depriving everything is, it should be ridiculed and stopped(!?!)

"Frustration" can't abide jokes.

Clinging and attachment can be distracting.


Gassho,
Myosha

[Jika]

In Praise of the Unlived Life

May I ask, why does he praise it?
In addition to making the title interesting and make people wonder and buy the book?

I'm not knowledgeable to answer your question, but his "frustration" seems to cover some dukkha, I agree.

Gassho,
Danny

[Joyo]

Thanks for sharing, Kirk. This is a very powerful little quote. In the end, the one that is being "deprived" perhaps is nothing more than a story or fantasy that never existed in the first place? Just speaking from my own experience.

Gassho,
Joyo

[Rich]

Laugh at frustration or the joke is on you.

Kind regards. /\

[Ryumon]

May I ask, why does he praise it?
In addition to making the title interesting and make people wonder and buy the book

The book is about the idea that we shouldn't worry about the many lives that we imagine but don't live. It's about embracing the life we have rather than imagining what might have been.

Gassho,

Kirk


(Posted from my iPhone; please excuse any typos or brevity.)

[Ryumon]

Thanks for sharing, Kirk. This is a very powerful little quote. In the end, the one that is being "deprived" perhaps is nothing more than a story or fantasy that never existed in the first place? Just speaking from my own experience.

Gassho,
Joyo

Yes, that's exactly what the book is about, as I said above on another reply.

Gassho,

Kirk


(Posted from my iPhone; please excuse any typos or brevity.)

[Jundo]

My too simple definition of Dukkha.

Buddha-Basics (Part I)

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?7720-Buddha-Basics-%28Part-I%29-%C2%97-Scooby-Dooby-Dukkha

Buddha-Basics (Part II) — Noble Truths

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?7719-Buddha-Basics-%28Part-II%29-%C2%97-Noble-Truths

More than merely "frustration" (although that too), Dukkha is the angst, dissatisfaction, divisions and frictions between the endless ways we would wish things to be and this self-life-world as it is.

Gassho, J

[Joyo]

My too simple definition of Dukkha.

Buddha-Basics (Part I)

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?7720-Buddha-Basics-%28Part-I%29-%C2%97-Scooby-Dooby-Dukkha

Buddha-Basics (Part II) — Noble Truths

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?7719-Buddha-Basics-%28Part-II%29-%C2%97-Noble-Truths

More than merely "frustration" (although that too), Dukkha is the angst, dissatisfaction, divisions and frictions between the endless ways we would wish things to be and this self-life-world as it is.

Gassho, J

Thank you for this, Jundo. I know, for myself, I have been much more aware of m own frictions between the endless wishing. I have likened it to scratching my nails on a huge rock, desperately trying to move it, not realizing that behind me is a beautiful valley full of wonder and life.

Gassho,
Joyo

[Amelia]

An interesting take on zazen that I heard once:

"The monks must sit there, not wishing for anything."

It's not how I define shikantaza, but when I heard it a few months ago, it opened up a space in practice. I noticed how much I go on, constantly wishing.

Gassho

[Ishin]

Thank you for this, Jundo. I know, for myself, I have been much more aware of m own frictions between the endless wishing. I have likened it to scratching my nails on a huge rock, desperately trying to move it, not realizing that behind me is a beautiful valley full of wonder and life.

Gassho,
Joyo

Joyo, that is really great!

Gassho
C

[alan.r]

An interesting take on zazen that I heard once:

"The monks must sit there, not wishing for anything."

It's not how I define shikantaza, but when I heard it a few months ago, it opened up a space in practice. I noticed how much I go on, constantly wishing.

Gassho

Nice. I like that a lot. Reminds me of this song:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B2MxfhP48q8

Gassho

[Nindo]

I've been reading a book called Missing Out: In Praise of the Unlived Life by Adam Phillips, who is a psychoanalyst. He talks about "frustration," and the way he describes makes a good parallel with dukkha:


"there are (at least) four kinds of frustration: the frustration of being deprived of something that has never existed; the frustration of being deprived of something one has never had (whether or not it exists); the frustration of being deprived of something one has had; and, finally, the frustration of being deprived of something one once had, but can’t have again."

Gassho,

Kirk

I listened to a podcast interview with the author, and the book seemed really interesting. When I got it from the library however, I just could not get into it. It was too theoretical for me; I was expecting case studies from the author's clients, or something closer to real life experience. I guess the basic idea was well summarized in the interview, good enough.