Traditional healing practice.

[michaelw]

What form of medicine or healing would have traditionally been used in a Zen monastery?
Is any form of holistic practice used within Zen other than the lifestyle? I see some of the European sangha advertise workshops for Qi Gong, Shiatsu and Do-In at their Sesshin together with calligraphy and Kesa sewing.

At Tai Chi last week, we were doing a Qi Gong exercise for grounding that was not unlike Kinhin. The teacher is always banging on about Chi energy flows and how to breath. Is there any healing practice unique to Japan or is it all derived from Chinese practice?
Gassho
MichaelW

satlah

[Jundo]

What form of medicine or healing would have traditionally been used in a Zen monastery?
Is any form of holistic practice used within Zen other than the lifestyle? I see some of the European sangha advertise workshops for Qi Gong, Shiatsu and Do-In at their Sesshin together with calligraphy and Kesa sewing.

At Tai Chi last week, we were doing a Qi Gong exercise for grounding that was not unlike Kinhin. The teacher is always banging on about Chi energy flows and how to breath. Is there any healing practice unique to Japan or is it all derived from Chinese practice?
Gassho
MichaelW

satlah

Well, in the days before modern medicine, it was traditional Chinese medicine and folks remedies. That is probably why the average life expectancy in old Japan was 30 to 50 years.

I do not put much credence into "chi energy flows," and believe that do do not really exist (I say that having lived in China and Japan most of my life), and I do not believe that accupressure or shiatsu message work any particular physiological healing beyond simple massage. Tai Chi (which our Washin teaches) is helpful for physical strength and flexibility, not more. Same for yoga.

That is just my opinion. I do not wish for alternative medicine approaches to be taught through this Sangha because, for every one that may have some worth, there are 10 that are questionable. I believe in science based medicine and vaccines (although I also believe that "Big Pharma" and for profit medicine can be evil.)

Many Sangha have some courses because it attracts participants. I do not want to attract participants to our Sangha in such a way.

Gassho, Jundo
stlah

PS - There are some Japanese breath practices similar to Qi Gong, and some Zen teachers teach that. I do not believe that the techniques work any special effect on health.

[Ryumon]

Breathing exercises can have an effect on health: mental health as well as respiratory health. Not that the Japanese would have known much about respiratory health at the time, but they may have had some secondary effects beyond the "zen" aspect.

And life expectancy; don't forget that it's not the age that people attain, but an average of all people born. So high infant mortality reduces life expectancy by a great deal.

Gassho,

Ryūmon (Kirk)

Sat Lah

[Seikan]

Agree with Kirk on breathing exercises. If I may, I'll put on my yoga teacher hat for a brief moment, but not to promote any alternative therapies—only to share some science-backed thinking on this topic.

Amidst all the various breathing exercises that are out there (many of them are questionable and in need of proper studies), there are at least a handful that are well-supported by scientific research and worth noting.

One very accessible example is how simply (re-)learning to breathe from one's diaphragm and belly (like an infant) can help to better oxygenate the blood, reduce stress, potentially improve blood pressure, etc. (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31436595/). And, as such, it tends to promote a calmer state of mind. Many folks these days, due to poor posture, stress, etc., will often hold their torsos in ways that restrict the diaphragm and interfere with the natural "belly breathing" that our bodies are designed for. To counteract this, our bodies will often compensate by using the chest and upper back muscles to suck air in. And at the very least, that is a far less efficient form of breathing. If you've ever felt yourself take a sharp breath with your upper chest/clavicle area to help "catch" your breath, that MAY be due to a restricted diaphragm due to posture, etc. (best to check with a health professional if this happens to you all the time).

The good news is that Zazen (and other meditation) postures that are typically prescribed, when followed as close as one's body allows, will typically promote this natural belly breathing. And as we re-adapt to that form of natural breathing again, we may find that it carries over into other parts of our waking life to a greater extent.

Gassho,
Seikan

stlah

[Jundo]

One very accessible example is how simply (re-)learning to breathe from one's diaphragm and belly (like an infant) can help to better oxygenate the blood, reduce stress, potentially improve blood pressure, etc. (https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31436595/). And, as such, it tends to promote a calmer state of mind. Many folks these days, due to poor posture, stress, etc., will often hold their torsos in ways that restrict the diaphragm and interfere with the natural "belly breathing" that our bodies are designed for. To counteract this, our bodies will often compensate by using the chest and upper back muscles to suck air in. And at the very least, that is a far less efficient form of breathing. If you've ever felt yourself take a sharp breath with your upper chest/clavicle area to help "catch" your breath, that MAY be due to a restricted diaphragm due to posture, etc. (best to check with a health professional if this happens to you all the time).

The good news is that Zazen (and other meditation) postures that are typically prescribed, when followed as close as one's body allows, will typically promote this natural belly breathing. And as we re-adapt to that form of natural breathing again, we may find that it carries over into other parts of our waking life to a greater extent.

I will second this, not just for Zen, but for daily activities whether gardening, sports, or opera singing (my mother was a jazz singer and always spoke of breathing from the diaphragm for that and in general). Many of our Zen activities beside Zazen, from chanting to cleaning, emphasize nice, deep breathing. I do not think it a panacea, but we do tend to breathe too high in the chest, and miss out on oxygenating ourselves with all the lungs' resources.

Gassho, J
stlah

[michaelw]

Breath: The New Science of a Lost Art by James Nestor is worth a read. I didn't take much notice of it until I heard Michael Mosley talking about breath and breathing in his BBC R4 Medical programme. Breathing techniques seem to be important in Tibetan Buddhism.

Gassho
MichaelW

satlah

[Jundo]

Breathing techniques seem to be important in Tibetan Buddhism.

Yes, but many Tibetan breath practices (Zen too) and other traditional claims are based on pseudo-science, magic and old wives tales. There is also much of value in traditional medicine and such, but until demonstrated with reliable evidence it is hard to separate the wheat and chaff.

Gassho J
Stlah

[Seiraku]

I think drinking tea and eating plant-based foods are other healthy things that go along with zen life. The tea plant has some potentially helpful compounds like L-theanine. I like drinking 20-year old Chinese puerh and matcha. Not as medicine for anything specific though.

Brogan
satlah

[Seiko]

how to breath

Q. How to breathe?
A. Continuosly.

Q. How long to breathe?
A. As long as you are alive.

I recently had a surgery to straighten out the inside of my nose. I hope it improves my ability to breathe and helps me to carry on breathing for a few more years.

Gasshō Seiko stlah