Blah, Blah, Blah.

[Jishin]

Sometimes I find myself talking for the sake of talking, no content conveyed. No content in the action of talking and no content in the words spoken, just discursive thought, expressed in words. I think my ego does this to affirm that it exists. As long as I can engage myself with thought or engage others in my thoughts, I distract myself from the idea of nothingness or the idea of death. Fear of a wave disappearing into the ocean when it always has been the ocean.

May I cultivate through Zazen the need to talk only when I have something to say.

JC

[Taigu]

And in doing and wishing so, JC, you do excatly the opposite: perfect bla blah blah.

gassho

Taigu

[Jundo]

Yes, sometimes I like a good chat ... about something "serious" or complete nonsense. Sometimes I like to blather just to blather.

And sometimes is the timeless time for silence.

What is wrong with any of that, if in the proper measure and time?

Gassho, J

[Omoi Otoshi]

Sometimes it's a good idea to shut up. Zazen is easier when we are quiet!
Sometimes we feel the need to calm the mind and giving the blah blah blah a rest can help us open the hand of thought.
But it's natural for humans to talk, so there's no point in staying silent all the time.
No need to force ourselves to talk, no need to force ourselves to stay quiet.
When the mind is quiet, the mouth will be quiet. When the mind is discursive, the mouth will be discursive too.
Don't worry, even the most profound words are mostly blah blah blah anyway.

Gassho,
/Pontus

[Mp]

I agree with all these great points! I find it is all about balance, but sometimes that balance can be a bit lopsided, but that too is ok. We are naturally social creatures, so I think it is ok the blah blah blah once in awhile even thought the blah blah blah is just that ... it might be more of just connecting and being a part of something.

Gassho
Michael

[alan.r]

A really beautiful talk can be like silence. A really beautiful talk highlights silence and plays with it and often points to it. A conversation in which two people share (instead of thinking about what one is going to say and waiting to talk) and really give to one another and play with one another and leave space for one another - that is not two. For me (and this coming from a writer who talks a bunch of nonsense) words aren't only a way to say or communicate, they are a way to be: one can be selfish or selfless through them; one can be separate or together through them.

Gassho,
alan

[Jishin]

And in doing and wishing so, JC, you do excatly the opposite: perfect bla blah blah.

gassho

Taigu

Taigu,

Little mind says 'thank you for affirming that I am alive by talking to me.'
Big Mind I am not sure.

May I find out more through Zazen.

Thank you all for your imput.

[Saijun]

Sometimes I find myself talking for the sake of talking, no content conveyed. No content in the action of talking and no content in the words spoken, just discursive thought, expressed in words. I think my ego does this to affirm that it exists. As long as I can engage myself with thought or engage others in my thoughts, I distract myself from the idea of nothingness or the idea of death. Fear of a wave disappearing into the ocean when it always has been the ocean.

May I cultivate through Zazen the need to talk only when I have something to say.

JC

Hello John,

As someone who often says far, far more words than are needed, I would like to offer a little of my own experience grappling with the so-called Great Question.

Make a cup of tea (or coffee if that is your wont; I'm going to proceed with tea). Then consume it. Then wash the cup.

Where does "tea" become "tea"? Does it lose it's "tea-ness" when you drink it? Is the tea-cup really a tea-cup when there's no tea to go in it?

Take all the questions, bundle them up tightly, and toss them in the fire under the kettle. Then, just be with the tea as you sip it.

It's more "helpful" than you would think, and even if it isn't, you get a few quiet moments and a cup of tea out of the deal.

Thank you for your practice.

In Gassho,

Saijun

[Dosho]

John,

Nothing wrong with a little chit-chat in my opinion...we all wrestle with our ego in different ways and the fact that you have observed this behavior really is the most import thing, at least in my experience. Others differ I'm sure.

Gassho,
Dosho

[Kyonin]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diT3FvDHMyo

Gassho,

Kyonin

[disastermouse]

You won't get anywhere trying to strangle your discursive mind. Even if you can shut it up through sheer force of will for a little while, you can bet it's going to have a lot to say when you take your hand off its throat.

It seems that you think that the Buddhist path requires becoming different than you are- a new egoic occupation. However, acting more Buddhist or trying outwardly to be a 'good Buddhist' will likely backfire. Buddhism - especially Mahayana - is not a path of ruthless cutting.

Take your analytic mind and set it on the pure interrogative. Ask intensely who it is that your chatter is talking about - with genuine curiosity and compassion.

Chet

[Jinyo]

You won't get anywhere trying to strangle your discursive mind. Even if you can shut it up through sheer force of will for a little while, you can bet it's going to have a lot to say when you take your hand of its throat.

It seems that you think that the Buddhist path requires becoming different than you are- a new egoic occupation. However, acting more Buddhist or trying outwardly to be a 'good Buddhist' will likely backfire. Buddhism - especially Mahayana - is not a path of ruthless cutting.

Take your analytic mind and set it on the pure interrogative. Ask intensely who it is that your chatter is talking about - with genuine curiosity and compassion.

Chet

This brought up a deep smile of recognition.

Thank you Chet,

Gassho

Willow

[Nengyo]

I recently read a short story on robots, future life, etc. In the book they talk about how they would one day implant a device in the brain stem that would allow people to voluntarily cut off all their senses allowing for an uninterrupted and instant deep meditation. Everyone would become a zen master according to the story. All I could think about is how crazy my thoughts would go without the "real" world to distract it occasionally. I hope that losing all your senses isn't the "true" zen path!

Either way blah, blah, blah or not our true selves just keep on ticking.

[Daitetsu]

All I could think about is how crazy my thoughts would go without the "real" world to distract it occasionally. I hope that losing all your senses isn't the "true" zen path!

Zen is everyday life, not some fancy trance-like state of mind. So you can keep all your senses, I'd say.
You just should avoid attachment...
Post edit: We need our "ego" in order to exist in everyday life - there is no way and no reason to switch it off entirely.


BTW: Even if you did self-hypnosis (which I used to do, but has nothing to do with Zen), you'd keep all you senses during "trance".

[Taigu]

It seems that you think that the Buddhist path requires becoming different than you are- a new egoic occupation. However, acting more Buddhist or trying outwardly to be a 'good Buddhist' will likely backfire. Buddhism - especially Mahayana - is not a path of ruthless cutting.

Take your analytic mind and set it on the pure interrogative. Ask intensely who it is that your chatter is talking about - with genuine curiosity and compassion.

These words Chet are really spot on.

JC, don't worry about small and Big mind. Don't try to find more, please. And take care.

gassho


Taigu