ego = self?

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  • SyntaxJO
    Member
    • Aug 2011
    • 72

    ego = self?

    The self, that we will all realize does not exist–with our prolonged practice–is this self the same as ego?
    My name is: Jordan.
  • Jiken
    Member
    • Jan 2011
    • 753

    #2
    Self is your identity or "soul". Ego is believing in self importance. Both of which exist and do not. My opinion only. See Taigu's hermitage poem



    Daido

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    • SyntaxJO
      Member
      • Aug 2011
      • 72

      #3
      Originally posted by Daido
      Self is your identity or "soul". Ego is believing in self importance.
      Yea, what's the difference?
      My name is: Jordan.

      Comment

      • Jiken
        Member
        • Jan 2011
        • 753

        #4
        in subjective terms you can believe in yourself (self). you can also believe that yourself is important or not important (ego). Not sure what else you are looking for? Maybe you are making some kind of profound zen like statement?

        Daido

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        • SyntaxJO
          Member
          • Aug 2011
          • 72

          #5
          No, it's good stuff. I'm seeing them as merging together–like body/mind–where the belief inherently creates importance. But, if that is the distinction, thank you for pointing that out.
          My name is: Jordan.

          Comment

          • Komatsu
            Member
            • Jul 2012
            • 6

            #6
            When thinking of "self" I think more of an ontological entity, experienced existentially. "Ego", for me, is a psychological name for a batch of mechanisms that occur based upon assumptions made about the reality of the self-in-the-world.

            The substantial nature of each maybe questioned at will.

            Comment

            • RichardH
              Member
              • Nov 2011
              • 2800

              #7
              The basic view across Buddhist traditions is that all things (including body and mind) are impermanent and without an unchanging self-essence.. or experiencer. This absence of an abiding self-essence is called Anatman. Anatman is an upaya, or an antidote, to the sickness of self-view, and not an absolute truth to be clung to. In other words, don't get stuck in "no self"

              There is a very real "person", or social agent, called Bob, or Sue... who is responsible for conduct and so forth. That social "self" needs psychological and emotional health.

              In short, within society this body and mind has agency, but within this body and mind no absolute agency can be found.

              But it is better to not ruminate on this, and just practice with the guidance of a teacher and the support of a sangha.

              Gassho, kojip

              Comment

              • Jundo
                Treeleaf Founder and Priest
                • Apr 2006
                • 39211

                #8
                Hi,

                Please stop all this wasteful semantic discussion.

                The sense of "self" is that self image "I" hold of my "self" separate from all things the "my self" deems "not myself" ...

                ... and the "self" is that selfish wanting, judging, dividing, categorizing, remembering, hoping, fearing, missing, running toward and running away, sense of birthing, sense of remaining, sense of dying that one can soften, and often fully drop away, in Zazen.

                That is all you need to know. Not rocket science.

                The rest of this discussion is a waste of breath. Call it "ego", call it "self", call it "atman", call it "dingo wingo", call it whatever the hell your self wants.

                Gassho, J
                Last edited by Jundo; 07-24-2012, 09:41 PM.
                ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

                Comment

                • RichardH
                  Member
                  • Nov 2011
                  • 2800

                  #9
                  Ok. No more wasteful discussion.

                  Gassho, kojip.

                  Comment

                  • RichardH
                    Member
                    • Nov 2011
                    • 2800

                    #10
                    Hey, Jundo.. Do you want to hear a silly bit of self? I actually thought for a moment of apologizing for posting my response... ..an ordinary response.. within the terms of service.

                    Gassho.

                    Comment

                    • Jundo
                      Treeleaf Founder and Priest
                      • Apr 2006
                      • 39211

                      #11
                      Ah, well, speaking for myself ... I hope I did not bruise anyone's ego.

                      Gassho, J
                      ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

                      Comment

                      • Jundo
                        Treeleaf Founder and Priest
                        • Apr 2006
                        • 39211

                        #12
                        Originally posted by Kojip
                        The basic view across Buddhist traditions is that all things (including body and mind) are impermanent and without an unchanging self-essence.. or experiencer. This absence of an abiding self-essence is called Anatman. Anatman is an upaya, or an antidote, to the sickness of self-view, and not an absolute truth to be clung to. In other words, don't get stuck in "no self"

                        There is a very real "person", or social agent, called Bob, or Sue... who is responsible for conduct and so forth. That social "self" needs psychological and emotional health.

                        In short, within society this body and mind has agency, but within this body and mind no absolute agency can be found.

                        But it is better to not ruminate on this, and just practice with the guidance of a teacher and the support of a sangha.

                        Gassho, kojip
                        By the way, nothing in any of the above to find fault with. Sounds about right to me (speaking for myself, anyway).
                        ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

                        Comment

                        • RichardH
                          Member
                          • Nov 2011
                          • 2800

                          #13
                          Easily bruised, easily forgotten...

                          Comment

                          • Jiken
                            Member
                            • Jan 2011
                            • 753

                            #14
                            The skin's pretty thick here...especially since you're right

                            Daido

                            Comment

                            • disastermouse

                              #15
                              Originally posted by Daido
                              Self is your identity or "soul". Ego is believing in self importance. Both of which exist and do not. My opinion only. See Taigu's hermitage poem



                              Daido
                              No. I disagree. Ego is not just believing in self-importance. It's thinking that identity is real. If you try to reify anything like a soul or identity....well, that's hopelessly wrong-headed.

                              There is no soul. There is no self. And yet, rejecting self too vociferously becomes an expression of self. Looking to put your foot firmly on any ground regarding these questions becomes an expression of self-delusion.

                              IMHO, of course.

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