Something to believe in?

[Jundo]

When ever someone asks something or says something about what Buddhists believe I always think about the Kalama Sutra.

"Rely not on the teacher/person, but on the teaching.
Rely not on the words of the teaching, but on the spirit of the words. Rely not on theory, but on experience.
Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it.
Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations.
Do not believe anything because it is spoken and rumored by many.
Do not believe in anything because it is written in your religious books.
Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders.
But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and the benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it."

Hope that is helpful

Gassho,
Jordan

Jordan,

I want to thank you so much for this. It will be part of our 'official' tenets around Treeleaf.

Gassho, Jundo

[Fuken]

Jundo,

You are so very welcome!

Gassho,
Jordan

[Jundo]

Hi Jundo. I didn't mean to make it seem like you were kidding or degrad your beliefs at all. I meant to say that you have your beliefs and each person must decide for themselves in the end.

Gassho Will

Hi Will,

I want to say again that I believe in Buddhist Heavens and Hells, Buddhas (apart from the historical Shakyamuni) and Boddhisattvas, and all the rest of the Buddhist cosmology, in much the spirit of that famous essay ... "Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus". Did you ever read that? A little girle wrote to a newspaper editor, back in 1897, saying that she'd heard from friends that there is no Santa Claus. "Is it true?", she asked. Part of the response ran like this ...

What? You don't believe in Santa Claus?

Gassho and Ho Ho Ho, Jundo

VIRGINIA, your little friends are wrong. They have been affected by the skepticism of a skeptical age. They do not believe except [what] they see. They think that nothing can be which is not comprehensible by their little minds. All minds, Virginia, whether they be men's or children's, are little. In this great universe of ours man is a mere insect, an ant, in his intellect, as compared with the boundless world about him, as measured by the intelligence capable of grasping the whole of truth and knowledge.

Yes, VIRGINIA, there is a Santa Claus. He exists as certainly as love and generosity and devotion exist, and you know that they abound and give to your life its highest beauty and joy. Alas! how dreary would be the world if there were no Santa Claus. It would be as dreary as if there were no VIRGINIAS. There would be no childlike faith then, no poetry, no romance to make tolerable this existence. We should have no enjoyment, except in sense and sight. The eternal light with which childhood fills the world would be extinguished.

http://www.newseum.org/yesvirginia/

[Justin]

All,

This is a fascinating thread. Thanks to all for their contributions.

Gassho.

[will]

What? You don't believe in Santa Claus?

Thanks Jundo.

Gassho Will

[Eika]

I sympathize with you Paige.
It sounds to me like the argument that occurs in nearly all religions: 'literal' interpretation vs. symbolic or metaphorical interpretation. I, personally, think that most of the Buddhist writings (sutras, etc) are completely correct in terms of describing reality using symbolism and metaphor. Hell exists for me. When I am scattered, frustrated, angry, sad, even happy, I sense the hellishness of it because those states are inherently unsatisfactory. That hell never ends unless I drop it and get out of the cycle. That is the relief that I have found in the few glimpses I have had of the truth as I see it. I believe in reincarnation in that I am constantly being reborn as a new person (whatever that is). Each moment is a new universe, a new big-bang. It is my job to be sure that I am aware so that I will not be born into a hell, but the heaven of the present. Somehow this sounds a lot more pretentious that I want it to, but that is my take. I get very frustrated with unquestioned orthodoxy of any sort, be it Buddhist, Christian, or whatever.

Later,
Bill

[paige]

Wow, thank you all for your great replies, and for sharing your experiences so openly. It feels like I'm getting to know some of you much better - thanks!

I'm glad Hans did say something about having faith in practice. Didn't Dogen, Hakuin and Hsu Yun all speak of the importance of Great Doubt and Great Faith? To sit goalless zazen day after day requires a lot of trust and faith, I think. There's "nothing to achieve," so you know we'll never get measurable results!

Will, reading

I am starting to believe in the possiblity for a life with joy and happiness involved.

put a big smile on my face.

Martin, I really emphasised with your comments on not being able to force yourself to believe in something because some authority says you have to, or because everyone else does. I'm very much the same way. I'm also terrible at 'faking it.' (Which is why I'm shocked that anyone at all really does think I'm a 'real Buddhist!')

I may come back as a mosquito in my next life, and that would suck".

Haha! That's cute. I knew there was a reason I liked you, Helena!

Thank you all again for such a great discussion. Every reply gave me a lot to think about, I'm grateful.

Deep gassho,
paige