Liturgy as part of daily practice

[Jundo]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Sorry to dig up an old-er thread but I had just finished Daido Roshi's book that Cyril referenced and wanted to ask a question or two. I have been trying to incorporate the liturgies into my daily practice and while I found the book somewhat useful, I was hoping to see if there was any further progress on the release of the Treeleaf Chant Book. Also, because I was curious what Jundo's opinion was of the book.

Hi,

I will look back at Daido's book this week and report some impressions. Perhaps we could adapt a few more suggested "daily liturgy" practices here.

However, I am generally one to suggest that each person take traditions and express them in ways which speak to one's heart.

We did update the Chant Book, and released it for the December Retreat ... It can be downloaded here.

http://www.treeleaf.org/sit-a-long/with ... 10---.html

Not all the contents are needed for daily practice. It does contain the Heart Sutra (many people appreciate to recite that each day, in English or Japanese), the Verse of the Kesa (for those who have received Jukai) and various 'Gatha' for reminding us of the sacredness of all actions ... washing the face, brushing the teeth, going to the toilet. Gatha are discussed here ...

http://www.treeleaf.org/sit-a-long/with ... 10---.html

We have various suggested daily practices ... such as Metta recital ...

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=1199

We have also had some talks in the past about "What can be a Buddha Statue".

Short answer: What is not a Buddha Statue?

http://www.treeleaf.org/sit-a-long/with ... tatue.html

We also have had some discussions of how to have an altar ... and, again, this is something for the heart. The Soto School in Japan has some instructions but (as discussed here), these are really too closely tailored to "Ancestor Worship" in Japan ...

viewtopic.php?p=25929#p25929

I will have some more to suggest in a few days after re-reading Daido's book.

In any event, our daily Liturgy or Liturgies is ... Zazen.

Gassho, J

[ghop]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

We have also had some talks in the past about "What can be a Buddha Statue".

Short answer: What is not a Buddha Statue?

It's answers like this that make Treeleaf feel like home. Thanks Jundo.

I got rid of my buddha statue a couple of months ago because it was making
my wife uneasy. I didn't mind. I could have made a big deal about it. But
hey, she's flesh and blood, and that statue, well... Now there is a betta fish
named Claudia (I didn't choose the name) sitting where the buddha sat. She
blows bubbles and looks at me when I feed her. Different form, same ol buddha.
I'm content either way.

gassho
Greg

[Omoi Otoshi]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Now there is a betta fish
named Claudia (I didn't choose the name) sitting where the buddha sat. She
blows bubbles and looks at me when I feed her. Different form, same ol buddha.
I'm content either way.

Made my day! :mrgreen:

[Onshin]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Hello peeps,
Like Jinyu I have kept an altar since teenage days, I minded to go through old photos and see how it has evolved over the years. I have a routine based mainly on OBC liturgy, I am trying to learn the Treeleaf translation of the Kesa verse in time for Jukai, i have used the OBC for so long now. The meaning is the same but one likes to do in Rome...etc. I look forward to seeing a copy of Loori's book on this and Jundo's take on it.

Gassho

Joe

[Jundo]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

I am trying to learn the Treeleaf translation of the Kesa verse in time for Jukai, i have used the OBC for so long now.

Each is an English translation and re-expression from the original Japanese, which is based on the original Chinese ... which may be based somewhere down the road on Sanskrit, then Pali ...

In other words, please use the version that speaks to you.

Gassho, J

[Risho]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

However, I am generally one to suggest that each person take traditions and express them in ways which speak to one's heart.

This is some advice that I really heed a lot during practice, and it inspires me. I find, personally, when I jump on the bandwagon of something (whatever it is) in the early stages of my discovering that thing, I will use that object to satisfy my ego's desire to be distracted. I have a big problem with boredom in my life, probably because I have an addictive personality.

My first few months of zazen were like this. My practice is a lot different now. I'm no longer so enamored by my zafu/zabuton or my buddha statue, etc. The bs has settled and now practice begins. That's not to say that I don't appreciate those elements to zen. I really do love it, I love the art, the writing, a lot of stuff about it, but I'm no longer as caught up in it, and I don't romanticize it as much.

In this vein, my liturgy practice has changed too. Instead of being so strict (and never really living up to some arbitrary rules I put down; i do that a lot too), I now chant the four vows and verse of atonement pretty regularly after each sitting; that's what we do here during zazenkai, so as a sangha member I really like to do with the sangha's doing. similarly I think sewing is a part of liturgy as well. Boy, I'd never thought I'd say that But I really think the liturgy I do, while personal, should also reflect what my teacher's are sharing with us in their practices.

Gassho Jundo and Taigu

In any case (and enough kissing butt. hahahah), Taigu mentioned (and I'll probably misquote it) take it easy in our practice. There may be a saying and I don't know who said this but the candle that burns brightest has the shortest life. What I mean is that how I practice now is to make it part of my daily life... nothing special. If I make it special it's separate from me, and I don't think that's what this is. If I stay consistent and don't overdo it, then I'll maintain my practice. If I push too hard, I'll burn out and this will just be another phase of my life; something I tried.

But that is not the Way at least from what I've learned. We share in a practice that's come down from generations, and so to honor it I stay consistent.

Ok I'm done rambling. lol

Gassho,

Cyril

[Kaishin]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Cyril,

I identify a lot with what you wrote above, and I think you've actually helped to solidify some concerns I have about my own practice.

Thanks for sharing,
Matt

[Al]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Each is an English translation and re-expression from the original Japanese, which is based on the original Chinese ... which may be based somewhere down the road on Sanskrit, then Pali ...

In other words, please use the version that speaks to you.

Gassho, J

Could you please tell us the original source (author, sutra?) of the Verse of the Kesa? My googlefu is failing me on this. It is a particular favorite of mine.

As a side note, I own the Zen Mountain Monastery Liturgy Manual and have found it to be a good purchase. I read sections of it almost every day.

[Jundo]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

However, I am generally one to suggest that each person take traditions and express them in ways which speak to one's heart.

This is some advice that I really heed a lot during practice, and it inspires me. I find, personally, when I jump on the bandwagon of something (whatever it is) in the early stages of my discovering that thing, I will use that object to satisfy my ego's desire to be distracted. I have a big problem with boredom in my life, probably because I have an addictive personality.

My first few months of zazen were like this. My practice is a lot different now. I'm no longer so enamored by my zafu/zabuton or my buddha statue, etc. The bs has settled and now practice begins. That's not to say that I don't appreciate those elements to zen. I really do love it, I love the art, the writing, a lot of stuff about it, but I'm no longer as caught up in it, and I don't romanticize it as much.

In this vein, my liturgy practice has changed too. Instead of being so strict (and never really living up to some arbitrary rules I put down; i do that a lot too), I now chant the four vows and verse of atonement pretty regularly after each sitting; that's what we do here during zazenkai, so as a sangha member I really like to do with the sangha's doing. similarly I think sewing is a part of liturgy as well. Boy, I'd never thought I'd say that But I really think the liturgy I do, while personal, should also reflect what my teacher's are sharing with us in their practices.

Gassho Jundo and Taigu

In any case (and enough kissing butt. hahahah), Taigu mentioned (and I'll probably misquote it) take it easy in our practice. There may be a saying and I don't know who said this but the candle that burns brightest has the shortest life. What I mean is that how I practice now is to make it part of my daily life... nothing special. If I make it special it's separate from me, and I don't think that's what this is. If I stay consistent and don't overdo it, then I'll maintain my practice. If I push too hard, I'll burn out and this will just be another phase of my life; something I tried.

But that is not the Way at least from what I've learned. We share in a practice that's come down from generations, and so to honor it I stay consistent.

Ok I'm done rambling. lol

Gassho,

Cyril

Cyril,

Wonderful, wonderful.

Grapes turn with time into fine, mellow wine ... a seedling into a great tree ... an infatuation into a timeless love affair ... an amateur into a skilled craftsman ...

Our way is a 'way of life' ... all time and space just living life ... you just living life ...

Deep Bows, Jundo

[jonhinkson]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

GASSHO

Thank you for this thread! I am often lost when it comes to liturgy, and so it is nice to see that I'm not doing anything "wrong" by listening to my intuition by not adding a special liturgy to my daily practice simply for the sake of its addition; to fill a spot in other words. And another thank you to everyone for your points of view/knowledge, it is very much appeciated.

gassho

Jonathan

[Taigu]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Hi all,

Yes Cyril, the idea is that I met people who were doing everything so well and so diligently...just to stop a couple of years down the line. It is important to cultivate a very quiet, steady, ordinary way. To let practice make the ordinary shine and reveal the ground of this extraordinary practice as nothing special.

gassho


Taigu

[Taylor]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Glad I stopped in to read. Thank you all very very much.

The Candle that flamed out a few times in life already,
Taylor

[Amelia]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

It is important to cultivate a very quiet, steady, ordinary way. To let practice makes the ordinary shine and reveal the ground of this extraordinary practice as nothing special.

Excellent advice! Thank you, Taigu. _/_

[Jundo]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Well, upon consultation with Taigu, I have put together a thread of 'Official' Treeleaf Recommended 'AT HOME' Liturgy!

Please have a look.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3308

I also will highly recommend there the book by Daido Roshi which was posted at the start of this thread ... "Celebrating Everyday Life" ... one of the wisest books I have read in ages ...

If you wish, we can continue the discussion here or there.

Gassho, Jundo

[Hogo]

Re: Liturgy as part of daily practice

Hi all,

Yes Cyril, the idea is that I met people who were doing everything so well and so diligently...just to stop a couple of years down the line. It is important to cultivate a very quiet, steady, ordinary way. To let practice make the ordinary shine and reveal the ground of this extraordinary practice as nothing special.

gassho


Taigu

Thank you.
Gassho.