Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

[Taylor]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Many thanks to everyone. I really should finish reading that sutra ops: I still find myself questing after that "pure blue sky" that never ends. An occasional glimpse at the wonder of ordinary life. Sit sit and sit again. :idea: *Questing again* :roll:

Taylor

[disastermouse]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

As Jundo said, the ordinary world is pretty extraordinary!

It's bad form to talk about kensho in Zen, but when has that stopped me before? From my own perspective, I'll say this -

It's not sufficient to wake up if you don't wake up again. And again.

You don't wake up by becoming an enemy of the not-awake state. They are the same, equally empty.

Don't chase kensho - it is right here, right now. There is nowhere to go.

IMHO.

Chet

[murasaki]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Self-sabotage is my answer to that question. I easily fall out of the habit of doing things that would be "good" for me in some way. My counsellor points it out and I don't know what to do about it. I just keep trying and re-trying.

[Taylor]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Sometimes zazen is what I want most during the day. Today for instance: This morning I sat the zazenkai from yesterday and I was filled with turbulent thoughts about this and that, very caught up in the clouds, often losing myself in my thoughts for long periods of time. So after I was done and now that I've gotten around the doing chores, I want to sit again. Mainly because I have an almost guilty feeling for being so wrapped up in thought. Sometimes zazen seems like redemption for all those times I wasn't mindful. Not a good approach to the entire thing.

Actualize enlightenment in everything, from sitting to washing the car. Here's my "capping verse" :P

Standing, I long to sit
Sitting, I long to stand
How strange.

Zazen is life and life is zazen, working more to actualize that.

Gassho

[Risho]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Zazen can be very difficult for me at times. For instance, I'm going through some stuff right now, and I literally saw and felt the flash of anger I have at the situation during zazen last night. Then I was able to "sit" with it. That's the first time it has happened where I've actually witnessed anger like that as opposed to reactively displaying the anger to the world.

[JohnsonCM]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Very well said, thanks. I think my issue is that I sometimes feel just the way you describe above - when I am walking, biking, hanging out in the park - but never while I am sitting zazen.

Ahhh, I see a pattern. And this is actually tied into what Jundo and Chet both said. Notice that in all of your examples, that feeling appeared while you were doing something else and kind of "got caught" by that moment. It may be that during zazen you are looking for that moment. Going back to the sunset analogy, if you said, "I'm going to look at sunsets, every night, until I get that feeling of being overwhelmed by beauty!" You'd probably sit there every night saying, "that sunset was perfect.......or would have been had there been a little more yellow." or blue, or whatever. The point is, when you TRY to LOOK for it, you'll always find something wrong with it, but when it catches you while hanging out in the park, and you just look over at that naturally occurring sunset with out a discriminating mind, you just kind of go, "oh....look at that....." That is what zazen is. Remove the questing mind, stop trying to find this kensho / enlightenment / satori moment, and just return to that buddha-nature state of original MIND. Then, when you least expect it, you might just sit and go, "oh...."

[Jundo]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Very well said, thanks. I think my issue is that I sometimes feel just the way you describe above - when I am walking, biking, hanging out in the park - but never while I am sitting zazen.

Ahhh, I see a pattern. And this is actually tied into what Jundo and Chet both said. Notice that in all of your examples, that feeling appeared while you were doing something else and kind of "got caught" by that moment. It may be that during zazen you are looking for that moment. Going back to the sunset analogy, if you said, "I'm going to look at sunsets, every night, until I get that feeling of being overwhelmed by beauty!" You'd probably sit there every night saying, "that sunset was perfect.......or would have been had there been a little more yellow." or blue, or whatever. The point is, when you TRY to LOOK for it, you'll always find something wrong with it, but when it catches you while hanging out in the park, and you just look over at that naturally occurring sunset with out a discriminating mind, you just kind of go, "oh....look at that....." That is what zazen is. Remove the questing mind, stop trying to find this kensho / enlightenment / satori moment, and just return to that buddha-nature state of original MIND. Then, when you least expect it, you might just sit and go, "oh...."

I remember as a teenager sitting on a beach at dawn, trying to "really and totally" experience a sunrise. My effort was a wall. The more I tried to make the experience "wow" and "perfect like a postcard" as I dreamed ... the further it slipped from my hands, like beachsand through my fingers. It was not fulfilling, I left the beach feeling dissatisfied and rather empty.

Now, I drop the effort ... drop all attempt to "really and totally experience" ... I stop "self checking" and "commenting/critiquing internally" ... thus to find the sunrise "real and totally experienced" all along. It was complete all along when I stopped trying to make it complete.

As well, that is true even on rainy and cloudy days, when the sun can barely be seen. It is true even at night, far from the beach.

(we are speaking both of literal sunrises here, and of "sunrises" as symbols for all of life)

Actualize enlightenment in everything, from sitting to washing the car.

You cannot make enlightenment more enlightenment any more than you can make the sunrise more the sunrise. Sometimes, the way to "actualize" is by not trying so hard.

[Taylor]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Actualize enlightenment in everything, from sitting to washing the car.

You cannot make enlightenment more enlightenment any more than you can make the sunrise more the sunrise. Sometimes, the way to "actualize" is by not trying so hard.

Gassho. A concept I still struggle with. Making something more than it is.

But, of course, the following question: Should I not try to "be present"? Car washing is just car washing, but car washing is also zazen (but don't think of it as zazen)?

[disastermouse]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

You are present. Where else could you be? Your distracting thoughts are also present - but what makes them distracting is your very desire for them not to be there.

Be there, with the sunset and with the thoughts - all equally empty and also quite 'real'.

You can't make reality more real

Chet

[Taylor]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Gassho, Chet. So here's my understanding, please, everyone, check me if I'm off base.

I sit here typing, only sitting here typing. In 5 minutes I will be zazening, only zazening. In the morning I will be waking, only waking. etc... Thoughts of "if only this" and "if only that" may and probably will come. But each moment is perfect in and of itsself. Rather than wishing for zazen while weeding, or wishing for kinhin while zazening, just do whatever need be done wholeheartedly. Nothing more to gain from any action than simply doing that action without deviation. Planting our feet on ground 10,000 times over and over whenever we find ourselves drifting away with the clouds again.

P.s. Craig, sorry for hijacking this.

[Jundo]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

But, of course, the following question: Should I not try to "be present"? Car washing is just car washing, but car washing is also zazen (but don't think of it as zazen)?

The answer is here, Daniel ... I mean, "Taylor" ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PycZtfns_U[/video]]

[Jundo]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

But, of course, the following question: Should I not try to "be present"? Car washing is just car washing, but car washing is also zazen (but don't think of it as zazen)?

The answer is here, Daniel ... I mean, "Taylor" ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PycZtfns_U[/video]]

In all seriousness, most moments of life, we can just go on about our business not trying to be "enlightened" or "buddha" or "zen" or "present" or "one with the universe" or "in the moment" or such. Just normal life. Just wash the car. Be the ordinary guy who has to wash the car in the ordinary way.

You can always summon up the "enlightened in the moment zen present buddha" when needed and appropriate (when you get the hang of how to do that), like a sunrise you can call up at will. Then a moment of car washing will wash away all time and space! Truly, then all reality will feel like it is washing! Like turning on and off the hose.

So ... turn on the music, get the soap and just wash the car without needing to make it a spiritual exercise (unless, of course, sometimes, you wish to do that!)

Anyway, you are enlightened and buddha in any case, and it is "perfectly what it is", whether wax on, wax off. car dirty or clean.

Something like that.

[Taylor]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

But, of course, the following question: Should I not try to "be present"? Car washing is just car washing, but car washing is also zazen (but don't think of it as zazen)?

The answer is here, Daniel ... I mean, "Taylor" ...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PycZtfns_U[/video]]

In all seriousness, most moments of life, we can just go on about our business not trying to be "enlightened" or "buddha" or "zen" or "present" or "one with the universe" or "in the moment" or such. Just normal life. Just wash the car. Be the ordinary guy who has to wash the car in the ordinary way.

You can always summon up the "enlightened in the moment zen present buddha" when needed and appropriate (when you get the hang of how to do that), like a sunrise you can call up at will. Then a moment of car washing will wash away all time and space! Truly, then all reality will feel like it is washing! Like turning on and off the hose.

So ... turn on the music, get the soap and just wash the car without needing to make it a spiritual exercise (unless, of course, sometimes, you wish to do that!)

Anyway, you are enlightened and buddha in any case, and it is "perfectly what it is", whether wax on, wax off. car dirty or clean.

Something like that.

Gassho. I just found a Sawaki Roshi quote that I believes applies, "Living out the buddha-dharma means fulfilling your function completely without knowing that you’re doing it. A mountain doesn’t know it’s tall. The sea doesn’t know it’s wide and deep. Each and every thing in the universe is active without knowing it."

It's hard to stop thinking about it and knowing it :?

[Jundo]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

Gassho, Chet. So here's my understanding, please, everyone, check me if I'm off base.

I sit here typing, only sitting here typing. In 5 minutes I will be zazening, only zazening. In the morning I will be waking, only waking. etc... Thoughts of "if only this" and "if only that" may and probably will come. But each moment is perfect in and of itsself. Rather than wishing for zazen while weeding, or wishing for kinhin while zazening, just do whatever need be done wholeheartedly. Nothing more to gain from any action than simply doing that action without deviation.

Before I head to bed (which I will do wholeheartedly), let me point you to one more old post.

It seems to me that many people in Zen Practice have come to confuse "being present/mindful in the moment" (for example, "when drinking tea, just drink tea" ... a sometimes appropriate and lovely way to experience life) with "being at one with the moment" (allowing and merging with conditions of life "just as they are"). The two are not quite the same, and are often confused, and the latter is much more at the heart of this Path ...

Hi,

We recently had a thread or two on "mindfulness". My teacher, Nishijima Roshi, rightly comments that the word "mindfulness" is bandied about a bit too much in the Western Buddhist world, and is overplayed. People have a very idealistic, unrealistic image of "mindfulness" in Zen practice.

"Mindful" can have a couple of different meanings in "Zen-glish". Some folks think it means (1) just to be aware of what they are doing in that moment, doing one action at a time. Some folks even think that the point of our practice is to be "mindful" of our every single activity all through our waking day, perhaps trying to live by doing one task at a time (when you eat, just eat ... when you walk, just walk). It is "being in the moment", and aware of the moment, one moment at a time.

Some folks think that it is (2) to develop an awareness of our motivations, psychological reactions and emotions in each situation.

Both those are good skills for Buddhists (especially 2), and I do not mean to say that we should not develop such abilities. But, on they other hand, they are only tools on our toolbelt, to be pulled out for use sometimes when appropriate. We are not to be that way 24/7, in each and every moment and situation.

I recently wrote the following on the subject of "mindfulness" ... I had just come back from hiking in the mountains near here with our Sangha member Hans ...

Hi,

As I was walking down Mt. Tsukuba with Hans yesterday, on a really steep incline of small muddy stones, I had to be mindful of what I was doing right there ... all to avoid falling on my butt in the mud

That's when I started thinking, "ah, yes, this is a time of mindfulness (type 1), there is balance of bodymind and I am present in this moment ... and I must tell the Treeleafers about it!" At which point, so filled with such wonderful thoughts was I, that I became distracted ... and slipped in the mud. (Fortunately, not enough so that butt hit stone). ops: ops:

I think that there are times to be mindful in our practice in that way, and great lessons are to be learned there ... drinking a cup of tea as the only and perfect act in the whole universe of that moment, the same for "Oryoki" meals during a Sesshin, "just being" in the moment, when washing the floor "just washing the floor". I think it does have the simplicity that Will and Alberto describe, and I think it is much like the "Mindbodyfull-ness" that Harry coined ... Harry is a musician, solo-ing on stage and all that, so he knows something of the topic.

But the one point I really really really wish to emphasize to folks is not to be too idealistic about what "mindfulness" is, or set it up as some unrealistic goal. I described it recently when I said this ...

[Folks encounter lots of Zen teachings like the one mentioned by Master Seung Sahn, "when you eat, just eat. When you sleep just sleep..."] But I think that Master Seung Sahn's phrasing, like many Zen books and expressions, can sound rather idealistic if it implies that we must be "mindful" or in "Zen Mind" 24/7. My view is more balanced I think, namely, "when mindful of one thing, just be mindful of one thing ... when distracted, overwrought and multi-tasking, just be distracted, overwrought and multi-task". There is a time for everything, and we cannot be "mindful" each minute. All of it is life.

However, one of the great fruits of our Zen Practice is that, even when we are distracted, overwrought and multi-tasking, feeling completely miserable and off balance ... and even when "Zen Mind" feels very far away ... we can still know it is 'there' even if we do not feel it at that moment [the blue sky always behind the clouds]. So I say, when feeling completely "miserable and off balance", just be "miserable and off balance" in that moment ... it too is a temporary state of mind.

So, in other words, have a balanced and realistic view of life ... even a balanced view of sometimes or frequently being unbalanced, overworked, distracted and such.

When falling on your butt in the mud because you were thinking about "mindfulness" ... JUST DO THAT! IT TOO IS A PERFECT ACT IN THAT MOMENT!!

Let me mention, before we go, the other common meaning of "mindfulness" in Zen-glish that, I believe, is perfectly valid (type 2). That is to develop some recognition and awareness of the causes and conditions of our mental states, the arising and passing of the various thoughts and emotions that pop in and out of mind. For example, developing a sensitivity to feelings of anger as they begin to arise within us, and before they grab hold of us.

I think that this is also a fundamental practice of Buddhism, right back to some of the first words out of the Buddha's mouth in Jetta Grove. It enables human beings to have some control over being prisoners of our thoughts and emotions, and we can more easily find balance and moderation, some self-control. So, it is a good awareness for a Buddhist. We come to see our experience of the world as largely a bit of theatre created by whatever emotions and ideas are floating through the brain at a given moment.

However, this too (in our Zen view) is not to be taken to extremes. Mindfulness of this type is a useful skill, but only sometimes. Most of the time we can just think and feel without having to be particularly analytical about it, or focused on being aware of it. There is a time for everything.

Gassho, Jundo

[Seishin the Elder]

Re: Is Zazen the highlight of your day?

I'm glad that you made this distinction Jundo, because I just could not see myself trying to control every single second of my life by being "aware" of them. I think I would become rather paralyzed with fear of making a mistake. Surely when I drink tea, I am drinking tea; but I might also be looking across the pond at a flight of geese. I would not particularly like to have missed the geese while I enjoyed the jasmine green tea.

This puts me in mind of the Eastern Orthodox monastic practice of Prayer of the Heart, or prayer without ceasing that St. Paul speaks about; which are equally part and parcel of the Hesychyst practice so well observed on Mount Athos or Russia. It is (without all the mumbo-jumbo, incense, candles and such) simply being aware of our living in the presence of eternity. Of course there were those who "over-exercised" this concept and went quite mad, or starved to death, or were eaten by bears :shock: ; but even better were those who applied the practices with what we call "economia", or in this sense, a modicum of reason and allowance for our imperfect understanding. So in that imperfect way they lived their simple lives reminding themselves that they lived in eternity, moment by beautiful moment.

Gassho,

Seishin Kyrill