Death

[Kevin]

I was thinking today about death and how it's perceived in society as something horrible, to be avoided at all costs. I was considering starting a personal photojournalism project regarding death, and was considering how others might perceive that as morbid or even offensive.

Though I have as much trepidation about my own death as anyone else (mostly thinking about the lost opportunities if I should die "early"), I don't seem to buy into the stigma associated with discussing and confronting death. It struck me, as I was thinking today, that death is a useful example of "acceptance without acceptance". That is, death is inevitable, absolutely inevitable. And it is the height of delusion to fight against death, to rage against it and the consideration of it, to attempt to ignore it or pretend it doesn't exist. If there is anything in our lives we MUST, at one time or another, accept, it is our own eventual death. Yet, accepting the fact of our own mortality does not naturally lead to suicide (though some, unfortunately, may choose this path). In much the same way (though at a different level of "importance"), accepting that my kids' bedrooms are filthy does not lead to my lack of effort to clean them (or to get my kids to clean them themselves).

For me, I find the contemplation of death to be a fantastic practice when I get too caught up in the concept of our world. The fact of death is undeniable and obvious to me, yet the bias in our culture against death is equally obvious. Contemplation of this opposition helps me find balance between the dark and the light (for you book club folks).

Gassho,
Kevin

[Jundo]

Re: Death

Hi Kev,

Well, the Buddha was sent off on his search for the answer to "Suffering" by seeing images of old age, sickness and death. Buddhist monks in many schools have meditated in cemeteries, near dead bodies or contemplating death ... impermanence ... the Grim Reaper ...

And that is all good and excellent ... so long as you also remember to sit with health and life too ... with children's smiles, springtime, and big red juicy apples.

It is --all-- the sides of a single, wonderful coin. In fact, all is impermanence, and that is not a problem ... so long as we let the wheel keep turning. One cannot have the Spring without the Summer, Fall and Winter.

(Of course, in our way of "Shikantaza", we do not sit particularly contemplating any one thing ... but rather, we are constantly sitting with -all of that-. I sit in cemeteries sometimes, but I also sit about anywhere one can sit. I think I will do some of that this coming week for the sit-a-long).

But, yes, an important Koan we should resolve for ourselves is this "Great Matter of Life and Death". Go for it! There are already some good Buddhist resources on the net too.

Gassho, Jundo

[Taigu]

Re: Death

Hi Kev,

I seem to remember a story about Marpa, the very teacher of Milarepa. When one of his beloved sons died, he started to weep and sob to the absolute amazement of his students. One of them asked him: why do you cry? Isn t death an illusion? And Marpa answered: Indeed but this is a super illusion!
Thank you for sharing your very insightful comments about death in our societies and on the path, and as Jundo said, I would invite you not to neglect life, to learn and experience in your body-mind that what we call death is nothing but life itself, that these two gates are one. A bit like Marpa, we may get a glimpse of this and yet, when it comes, we experience pain and tears, and I think there is nothing wrong with this.
Death does make us aprreciate our life too, as Suzuki roshi used to say, how unbearable the feeling of being immortal would be! The opposite of death doesn t seem to be life for me but something like: resistance. Resistance to change, resistance to let go of our opinions and beliefs, not allowing Autumn to be Autum and Winter to be Winter. In "allowing", death and life are just fine, are just together, a bit like the game two children would play in a sandpit.A good old Koan describes it as the fight of two wild buffalos entering the stream and disappearing in the waters.

gassho

Taigu

[disastermouse]

Re: Death

You know, I always thought that 'super-illusion' business was just a cop out - more showing his humanity than illustrating anything about the Dharma.

Chet

[Kevin]

Re: Death

The opposite of death doesn t seem to be life for me but something like: resistance. Resistance to change, resistance to let go of our opinions and beliefs, not allowing Autumn to be Autum and Winter to be Winter.

Yes, I completely agree, Taigu (welcome to the Treeleaf teacher role, too, though, for me, you have been there for quite some time!), with what you've said here and what Jundo mentioned above. For me, too, avoidance of death is an avoidance of life, like clutching so tightly to a fistful of water that the water drains all the more quickly from your hand. But, dropping this resistance opens one to a greater appreciation and understanding of life. Yes, resistance is a form of living death!

But, as Jundo also intimated, resistance to resistance is also a living death, and resistance is itself a part of the light side of our experience. All is one and all is not one; all is delusion and all is not delusion. I sometimes find myself thinking all this Zen stuff is just bulls**t, but then I realize it's because I'm getting caught up in all the words and the concepts, when the reality is not contained in the words, but in the words and the wordlessness and the mixture of the two. Just so is reality contained not in what we call "life" nor in what we call "death", but in both at the same time and in the mixture of the two.

I love to think about death (not in a morbid way) because it always brings me back into the present moment. And that is really the only moment there ever is.

Gassho,
Kevin

[Jundo]

Re: Death

But, as Jundo also intimated, resistance to resistance is also a living death, and resistance is itself a part of the light side of our experience. All is one and all is not one; all is delusion and all is not delusion. I sometimes find myself thinking all this Zen stuff is just bulls**t, but then I realize it's because I'm getting caught up in all the words and the concepts, when the reality is not contained in the words, but in the words and the wordlessness and the mixture of the two. Just so is reality contained not in what we call "life" nor in what we call "death", but in both at the same time and in the mixture of the two.

Beautiful lob and net work. Your game is improving.

Gassho, Tennis Coach Jundo

[Taigu]

Re: Death

Thank you Chet,

You know, I always thought that 'super-illusion' business was just a cop out - more showing his humanity than illustrating anything about the Dharma.

How can you separate what you call humanity from Dharma? Aren't they just one? Crying is a beautiful and true way to let the Dharma speak.

And yes Ken, almost ready for the US open...The "Unity State" :wink:


gassho


Taigu

[Shohei]

Re: Death

Hi Kev and all
Thank you for bring this up and (not that it matters) I think its a great idea!

I will a test to the living death of resisting death. When i was shocked into realizing my own mortality, besides ptsd, i really became scared of living. I avoided most travel, stayed inside and chain smoked (LOL the irony eh?), and self "medicated". For a few years. Beyond the ridiculousness of what i was doing, my mind showed me a 1000 ways i was going to die and suffer as i did. I took some time to see i created a hell worse than hell for myself and died many more times. Sheesh, I only have to die once.

Not only was this tearing me down I was hurting others around me with my inability to cope. Things have come aloooong ways from then and I do as you had mentioned, contemplate death and mortality, not just mine but loved ones and everyone's and it certainly resets perspective and find that balance!

A good friend, who served in the first gulf war, helped me outta my slump so to speak with some very straight forward advice... you can only take care of you and your loved ones today, death is coming whether [i] you [i] are ready or not - no point in waiting in horror for it, just go and live the best way you can. I have to thank him for me that advice... it may seem straight forward enough but sometimes ya need some one to point it out to you. I must say that I started on this path with that guys help and Ive told him so since.

I completely agree that we (i, us, you lol you know) have to embrace our mortality and our inevitable death with out laying down and becoming compost. No reason to stop going for our annual checkups or refusing treatment... Not a reason to avoid that flight.

As you said its very good practice

Gassho Shohei

[Tobiishi]

Re: Death

First, Kevin, if you did a project on death like you mentioned, I would love to see it. I have unconventional (for the US) attitudes about death and dying, and would welcome another viewpoint on the inevitable event. I've read several books on dying in different countries and cultures, as well as in the US (where unfortunately it has become commercialized like everything else)...
Unfortunately, I have not yet taken the time to study this topic from a Buddhist perspective, so I appreciate the commentary and teaching!

gassho

[Rich]

Re: Death

Even though I know I'm getting older and closer to death, I focus on making choices that give me health and longer life. The alternative is pain and suffering. It's not so much the fear of death, its more the fear of pain and suffering. When you lose someone close to you, you understand great loss and the interconnection with others. You actually lose a part of yourself.
/Rich

[disastermouse]

Re: Death

Fear death, don't fear death - it really doesn't matter. That's what makes death such a gift. It's coming and it doesn't care what you think about it.

Chet

[Jundo]

Re: Death

Fear death, don't fear death - it really doesn't matter. That's what makes death such a gift. It's coming and it doesn't care what you think about it.

Chet

It is also not coming, because we were never born.

A recent thread on that topic ...

viewtopic.php?p=20191#p20191

[Shindo]

Re: Death

Hi Guys

all good points raised above & most certainly death puts a lot of the petty issues in life into perspective. However, as I celebrate still being here three years after my bowel cancer diagnosis, I would just like to point out that this is not some academic exercise. To be told that you have a 70% chance of being dead in 5 years is horrible & fearful. At such points (for me anyway)the storm winds of suffering sweep away all the bastions of practice & you are left clinging to the wreckage. As Rich said earlier death can be associated with suffering, and also the pain and the mundanity of life continuing - can you get to the bathroom, the nausea & side effects of chemotherapy, the pains of surgery, dealing with a roller coaster of emotions - who will look after the children? what about my wife? etc.

If you are going to use death as a form of practice - you need to imagine that you have been given your prognosis & then try to make it as real as you can. When I was given mine I cried every day for six months - it was not a happy place to be.

Kind regards

Jools

ps apologies for taking this topic so seriously

[Tb]

Re: Death

Fear death, don't fear death - it really doesn't matter. That's what makes death such a gift. It's coming and it doesn't care what you think about it.

Chet

It is also not coming, because we were never born.

A recent thread on that topic ...

viewtopic.php?p=20191#p20191

Hi.

Thats why it's so good to sit with both life and death, to see that they are "illusions"...

Mtfbwy
Tb

[disastermouse]

Re: Death

Fear death, don't fear death - it really doesn't matter. That's what makes death such a gift. It's coming and it doesn't care what you think about it.

Chet

It is also not coming, because we were never born.

A recent thread on that topic ...

viewtopic.php?p=20191#p20191

Let's see if you can hang on to that view if you're wasting away in a hospital bed with bone cancer.

Chet