It is Vital to Hear Your Story: Turned from Considering Priesthood by Health/Age?

Collapse
X
 
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • Jundo
    Treeleaf Founder and Priest
    • Apr 2006
    • 40352

    It is Vital to Hear Your Story: Turned from Considering Priesthood by Health/Age?

    Dear All,

    I need your help if you are someone who, even for a moment, was ever considering pursuing the Path of Ordination as a Zen Priest, but gave up the idea of Ordination because of a health condition, disability or advanced age, or what you perceived as potential obstacles in doing so due to such conditions.

    I need you to tell your stories (anonymously, if you wish) in the following survey being conducted by the Soto Zen Buddhist Association. It is vital, and now is the time to speak up! Your story will help others have a chance in the future, and knock those obstacles down.

    The Soto Zen Buddhist Association, the organization of Soto Zen priests primarily outside Japan, has a long history of discrimination against the aged and disabled in their training requirements for priesthood and membership, throwing obstacles in the path of such individuals because of requirements for various residential and other physical acts of training, even if with often good intentions. This has rendered it difficult, and often impossible, for such people to become members of that organization. Furthermore, member Zen Sangha have placed like barriers on the path by their own physical requirements of ceremony, residential practice, labor and priest training. In many cases, persons have been dissuaded from even seeking ordination for fear that they could not meet the physical requirements. For years, some of us have raised challenge to such policies, but have been silenced or even punished and threatened with possible expulsion for doing so.

    Finally, the SZBA has formed a committee that may be a first step to dealing with these issues. It is conducting a survey that may (we can only hope) be a first crack of light to rectifying these issues. If you are someone, or know someone, who has encountered difficulty in considering Ordination, even as a passing consideration for a moment, or who met difficulties that discouraged you in completing your Zen training, please kindly respond to this anonymous survey that they are conducting. They have created the survey to find out more about the experience of Soto Zen priests, or those who had difficulty becoming or thinking about possibly becoming so, who have physical/mental disabilities or who identify as neuro-diverse.

    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

    Please take a look at the survey and fill it out if you have or have had a disability OR self-identify as facing a psychological/emotional challenge, with or without an official diagnosis.

    Please complete the survey by: February 14, 2022

    This survey is intended for both SZBA members with disabilities and Soto Zen practitioners with disabilities who are not SZBA members. If you know someone who is a Soto Zen priest or has considered priest training and has/has had a disability, please share this survey with them.

    This survey was designed to collect insight into the experience of Soto Zen Buddhist priests/practioners who have considered priest training who have/have had physical/mental disabilities, who identify as neuro-diverse, or self-identify as facing a psychological/emotional challenge. Please contact Anna (SZBA Operations Coordinator) if you have questions or additional comments by emailing info@szba.org


    THANK YOU! We need you to tell your stories to help many others in the future!

    Also, please spread the word about the survey!

    Gassho, Jundo

    STLah
    Last edited by Jundo; 01-10-2022, 01:52 AM.
    ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE
  • Tai Shi
    Member
    • Oct 2014
    • 3416

    #2
    Jundo this questionnaire is so long, it became difficult for me to focus. In the future warning the person.
    Gassho
    tai Shi


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

    Comment

    • Jundo
      Treeleaf Founder and Priest
      • Apr 2006
      • 40352

      #3
      Originally posted by Tai Shi
      Jundo this questionnaire is so long, it became difficult for me to focus. In the future warning the person.
      Gassho
      tai Shi


      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
      Hi TS,

      Let me write them and ask if I, or one of the priests, can help you respond.

      Gassho, Jundo

      STLah
      ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

      Comment

      • aprapti
        Member
        • Jun 2017
        • 889

        #4
        i participated



        aprapti

        sat

        hobo kore dojo / 歩歩是道場 / step, step, there is my place of practice

        Aprāpti (अप्राप्ति) non-attainment

        Comment

        • rqrusseth
          Member
          • Dec 2021
          • 4

          #5
          I filled out the questionnaire. I found it interesting how the questions were oddly worded; e.g., using phrases such as "atypical minds" seemed strange to me. Also the limited palate of choices in types of disabilities and/or mental health issues; e.g., depression was not mentioned expressly but anxiety was. Anyway, I thought I would share the gist of my answers to the questions to see if others had similar thoughts and want to share/discuss. As a deaf student, it is quite difficult to understand dharma talks or to participate in dokusan. Thus I turned to online training and dharma talks when those became available online - prior to the advent of the internet things were quite challenging! Also reading many books by zen teachers from various traditions. Mental health issues such as trauma, anxiety, general social anxiety and severe depression can and have impacted my ability to participate in group settings such as sesshin. Again, I have turned to "online Sanghas" in order to meet my needs. Physical impairments make it difficult to take the traditional lotus posture and many teachers seem vexed by my need to sit in a chair - as if enlightenment was limited to the very flexible.The real issue is the culture of SZBA - resources should be devoted to diversity training with emphasis on accommodation of and adaption to an individuals needs - this is not to say the requirements should be modified into nothingness but many of the requirements are seemingly not dictated by dharma but institutional culture. Changing the culture will be challenging in practice but certainly not impossible if approached with an open heart and desire to spread the Dharma to all - including those practicing with disabilities, atypical minds (?) or trauma. Richard -sattoday-
          Last edited by rqrusseth; 01-10-2022, 06:50 PM. Reason: typos

          Comment

          • Tai Shi
            Member
            • Oct 2014
            • 3416

            #6
            Originally posted by aprapti
            i participated



            aprapti

            sat
            Yes Jundo. First, I give you my permission to look at my response. I got too caught up in history and qualifications. I believe I can simply respond with the way I feel.
            Gassho
            sat/lah


            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
            Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

            Comment

            • Jundo
              Treeleaf Founder and Priest
              • Apr 2006
              • 40352

              #7
              Originally posted by Tai Shi
              Yes Jundo. First, I give you my permission to look at my response. I got too caught up in history and qualifications. I believe I can simply respond with the way I feel.
              Gassho
              sat/lah


              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
              I suggest that I or someone helps by asking you the questions one by one, putting your responses together. Then, the SZBA said that your responses can be emailed to them. Would that help, TS?

              Gassho, Jundo

              STLah
              ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

              Comment

              • Heiso
                Member
                • Jan 2019
                • 834

                #8
                I've also responded.

                They might be doing this but it would be good if they had a similar project to look at those who feel ordination isn't an option due to socio-economic reasons - like not being able to take time away from work to attend residential practice periods. Or those with caring/family responsibilities who similarly can't attend extended/residential practice periods.

                Gassho,

                Heiso

                StLah

                Comment

                • Jundo
                  Treeleaf Founder and Priest
                  • Apr 2006
                  • 40352

                  #9
                  Originally posted by Heiso
                  I've also responded.

                  They might be doing this but it would be good if they had a similar project to look at those who feel ordination isn't an option due to socio-economic reasons - like not being able to take time away from work to attend residential practice periods. Or those with caring/family responsibilities who similarly can't attend extended/residential practice periods.

                  Gassho,

                  Heiso

                  StLah
                  Tell me about it.

                  If only there were a Sangha that might Ordain such folks.

                  Gassho, J

                  STLah
                  ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

                  Comment

                  • Tai Shi
                    Member
                    • Oct 2014
                    • 3416

                    #10
                    It is Vital to Hear Your Story: Turned from Considering Priesthood by Health/Age?

                    If I can offer you my apology. I am doing so. Sometimes I must say I am sorry. I’m sorry.
                    Gassho
                    sat/ lah
                    Tai Shi


                    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                    Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

                    Comment

                    • Tai Shi
                      Member
                      • Oct 2014
                      • 3416

                      #11
                      It is Vital to Hear Your Story: Turned from Considering Priesthood by Health/Age?

                      Do I write or do I speak? I do not want to be a bother and what part of the survey yo need to know about? I am wondering if it is the written portion or the whole thing. What do you want me to talk about? I’m really confused about everything! Sorry all the pain is mine. Not true. Everyone has something.
                      Gassho
                      sat/ lah
                      Tai Shi


                      Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                      Last edited by Tai Shi; 01-14-2022, 04:21 AM.
                      Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

                      Comment

                      • Tai Shi
                        Member
                        • Oct 2014
                        • 3416

                        #12
                        It is Vital to Hear Your Story: Turned from Considering Priesthood by Health/Age?

                        Yes the young man/ woman before me spoke of a concern I have. The questions themselves are insensitive to folks with disabilities as schizophrenia, bipolar, ets, etc. also brain disorders which are biological although a case is made tha all physical and so called mental illness are the same. This is simply not true. Each person must be treated individually and not lumped in to the derogatory term mental illness and brain damage and brain disorder etc. each case is separate and even then medicine does a disservice by lumping brain disease such as AVM with mental illness and disorders. I have many friends in my my experience as board member of NAMI South Dakota and IOOV coordinator in South Dakota. The SZBA opens up some serious problems with the way statements are made about people with my diagnoses and my physical condition. We cannot lump all arthritis the same. Osteo arthritis is simply not the same as rheumatoid conditions but as this questionnaire does not begin to address some of these issues. I think this questionnaire must only be a rough draft for a more detailed form.
                        Gassho
                        sat/ lah
                        Tai Shi


                        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                        Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

                        Comment

                        • Jinyo
                          Member
                          • Jan 2012
                          • 1957

                          #13
                          Have filled in - but unless the organisation is completely divorced from the average person's reality it was a bit like stating the obvious.
                          I think the problem is they really only address standards set out for a bricks and mortar sangha that operates in a traditional manner - although
                          I can see that it could be argued that many of those principles are on offer and practiced here.
                          I don't feel they address how online communities function and with Covid pushing things even further in that direction I would think some kind of radical
                          reform is needed. At the level of diversity its an important issue but maybe what really needs to be redefined is what it it to be a priest in the Soto Zen tradition -
                          particularly no 3 on their list of standards - ministerial training. That's a muddy area for me because they strongly affirm pastoral care and leadership. What if one simply isn't able
                          to fulfill that role because of disability. Is it acceptable to fulfill a calling in a different way? As for all the formal Practice Intensives - nigh impossible with certain disabilities.

                          Sorry to go over,

                          Gassho,

                          Jinyo

                          Sat Today

                          Comment

                          • Jundo
                            Treeleaf Founder and Priest
                            • Apr 2006
                            • 40352

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Jinyo
                            Have filled in - but unless the organisation is completely divorced from the average person's reality it was a bit like stating the obvious.
                            I think the problem is they really only address standards set out for a bricks and mortar sangha that operates in a traditional manner - although
                            I can see that it could be argued that many of those principles are on offer and practiced here.
                            I don't feel they address how online communities function and with Covid pushing things even further in that direction I would think some kind of radical
                            reform is needed. At the level of diversity its an important issue but maybe what really needs to be redefined is what it it to be a priest in the Soto Zen tradition -
                            particularly no 3 on their list of standards - ministerial training. That's a muddy area for me because they strongly affirm pastoral care and leadership. What if one simply isn't able
                            to fulfill that role because of disability. Is it acceptable to fulfill a calling in a different way? As for all the formal Practice Intensives - nigh impossible with certain disabilities.

                            Sorry to go over,

                            Gassho,

                            Jinyo

                            Sat Today
                            Jinyo, this sums up the problems so nicely, may I quote you other places? (I won't specifically mention your name, just that "one of our members")

                            It would be a big help.

                            Gassho, Jundo

                            STLah
                            ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLE

                            Comment

                            • Tai Shi
                              Member
                              • Oct 2014
                              • 3416

                              #15
                              I talk too much. I sit more and look for Shikantaza which I will review for Jukai on Jundo’s videos for the newcomer.
                              Gassho
                              sat/ lah


                              Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
                              Peaceful, Tai Shi. Ubasoku; calm, supportive, for positive poetry 優婆塞 台 婆

                              Comment

                              Working...