Brad Warner on Shikantaza

[Bokucho]

Perhaps it's always time to start again.

Gassho,

Kirk

sat

It really is, isn't it? In our practice it's amazing how easy it is to forget that we're always beginners. Sho-shin.

Gassho,

Joshua
SatToday


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[Kokuu]

I also bought Okumura's guide to the Mountains and Waters Sutra, but as Jundo commented, it's not for beginners. It's quite dense—in Dogen's poetic way.

Yes, I think that is very true. I have read a lot of Dogen and am finding the need to take this particular book quite slowly.

Gassho
Kokuu
-sattoday/lah-

[Kevin M]

Truly "goalless" sitting means not to chase after or need "flow." It "flows" ... both when flow is felt and when it is not, even if some days feeling totally blocked.

Morning (here in Mexico) Rabbi,

I'm a little confused. I thought when we're sitting we are "supposed to" assume correct posture and release thoughts as they arise (this is what I think of when I hear "flow" i.e. more a psychological non-clinging than a metaphysical or Taoist "flow" - or perhaps a psychologically merging with that more metaphysical flow -- I don't know). How can Zazen always be right just the way it is, even when we're distracted and clinging to thoughts? Like if I sit with the intent of sitting, but end up ruminating over some argument I had at work the whole time, how is that right? What's the relationship between Zazen and the end of suffering?

Gassho,
Kevin
ST

[Jakuden]

Morning (here in Mexico) Rabbi,

I'm a little confused. I thought when we're sitting we are "supposed to" assume correct posture and release thoughts as they arise (this is what I think of when I hear "flow" i.e. more a psychological non-clinging than a metaphysical or Taoist "flow" - or perhaps a psychologically merging with that more metaphysical flow -- I don't know). How can Zazen always be right just the way it is, even when we're distracted and clinging to thoughts? Like if I sit with the intent of sitting, but end up ruminating over some argument I had at work the whole time, how is that right? What's the relationship between Zazen and the end of suffering?

Gassho,
Kevin
ST

That's such a perfect question! How Zazen can always be right just the way it is even if we are distracted and clinging to thoughts: it's a Koan. When we sit, "just right" and "distracted and clinging to thoughts" are not two. We sit on the walking mountains, in the space where "nothing is really exactly what we think it is," and "everything we think" meet.

Once we have followed instructions to assume the correct posture and the intention not to grasp and follow thoughts as they arise, we let go even of those instructions. That's when things flow on their own without our interference. With non-judgmental practice, eventually the flow becomes life and life becomes flow and there is no dissonance between the two.

Thank you for the video Kokuu!

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday

[Ryumon]

How can Zazen always be right just the way it is, even when we're distracted and clinging to thoughts? Like if I sit with the intent of sitting, but end up ruminating over some argument I had at work the whole time, how is that right? What's the relationship between Zazen and the end of suffering?

From what I understand - and I know nothing - if you are sitting with the right intent, and you notice that you are distracted and ruminating over some argument, then you are doing it right. We just need to keep noticing, then coming back to our center. Eventually - very slowly, like water eroding a rock - we'll see the spaces between the thoughts.

Gasso,

Kirk

sat

[Onka]

Yesterday I posted a pretty ordinary rant on this thread. I could have expressed it in a better, more gentle way. I sent an apology to Jundo last night.
Not sure if it's still up or not but I take ownership of the words I chose and apologise.
My poor health is no excuse to deviate so far from my practice.
Gassho
Onka
ST

[Jundo]

Morning (here in Mexico) Rabbi,

I'm a little confused. I thought when we're sitting we are "supposed to" assume correct posture and release thoughts as they arise (this is what I think of when I hear "flow" i.e. more a psychological non-clinging than a metaphysical or Taoist "flow" - or perhaps a psychologically merging with that more metaphysical flow -- I don't know). How can Zazen always be right just the way it is, even when we're distracted and clinging to thoughts? Like if I sit with the intent of sitting, but end up ruminating over some argument I had at work the whole time, how is that right? What's the relationship between Zazen and the end of suffering?

Gassho,
Kevin
ST

What Jakuden said is so precise.

It is our small self that wrestles with this conundrum. People think that things are only right when they feel right. A Buddha knows that things are still right whether right or wrong, beyond human views of what feels right. Nonetheless, do your best to head right, avoid the wrong.

Here is an example: We are walking Buddha Mountain, put on our good shoes, hope for clear weather and blue skies, seek to avoid the brambles and poison ivy, stay on the good trail. Sometimes it is wonderful, and we flow up and down and across the trail. Some days it rains, we wander off the trail or fall in the mud. It is still Buddha Mountain. Many people think that it is only right and Buddha Mountain when we reach some summit, or on those perfect days, or when the scenery opens to reveal boundless horizons in all directions. They think it wrong if they break a lace, break a leg, roll down in an avalanche. They think that it is only progress when we keep walking to reach some special place and finally get there.

It is true that we secure our shoes correctly, do our best to avoid the pitfalls, hope for clear skies. We don't stir up trouble by stirring up clouds or storms of thought. We hope and are cautious not to break a leg or fall in an avalanche. We keep moving, sometimes one foot after another, sometimes resting for awhile.

Yet it is all Buddha Mountain, was Buddha Mountain and will be Buddha Mountain wherever we go. The clear skies are Buddha Mountain, as is the storm. The beautiful scenes are Buddha Mountain, yet so is the mud and poison ivy..

In other words, we do our best to have a nice hike ... assume the good posture, let thoughts go without getting tangled in clouds of thinking and brambles of tangled emotion. Sometimes we sit, but do not sit forever. We walk on, knowing that each step is its own summit and arrival at its own destination. The destination is here and ever so. Nonetheless, though we may sit and rest for a time, we keep moving. The birds are singing, but so are the falling stones. Nonetheless, we do our best to avoid the falling stones.

Chances are an experienced hiker will be better at staying on the trail and avoiding mud, stones and brambles than the new fellow first starting to hike.

But the whole walk is the hike, the entirety is Buddha Mountain.

In fact, Buddha Mountain is walking up you as you walk Buddha Mountain. There is only one walking, for Buddha Mountain is you, the birds and sky, the walking. Mud holes are Buddha Mountain and shoe laces, broken or not, are Buddha Mountain. Clear skies and rain are hiking, are Buddha Mountain.

Nonetheless, we pack our rain gear for when we need, check our laces, seek to avoid the poison ivy. How LOVELY are those days or moments when the vistas open and the skies are clear! How LOVELY even on those days when not.

Like that.

Gassho, J

STLah

[Kevin M]

What wonderful answers. Thank you!



Gassho
Kevin
ST

[Washin]

How Zazen can always be right just the way it is even if we are distracted and clinging to thoughts: it's a Koan. When we sit, "just right" and "distracted and clinging to thoughts" are not two. We sit on the walking mountains, in the space where "nothing is really exactly what we think it is," and "everything we think" meet.

Gassho
Washin
sat today

[Shinshi]

I really like the hiking analogy Jundo.



Gassho, Shinshi

SaT-LaH

[Tairin]

Tairin
Sat today and lah

[Kyotaku]

Indeed nice analogy.
The book will arrivé today.
[emoji120]
Hans ,/ Hosei

St