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命 Mei - life
島 Tou - island -
Hi Joshua,
As many have alluded to already, I think your struggles are not uncommon and most of your brothers and sisters here have faced some version of this (I know I have).
A few views I have that hopefully are correct and helpful in your struggle with "many different answers":
1. The Dharma simply "is". The Buddha did not invent it. Dogen did not create it. Jundo does not make it up. Gautama Buddha made a discovery and as some say "set the wheel in motion". Teachers have been trying to help their students discover it for themselves ever since.
2. Teachings are not themselves "truth" - they are a means to help sentient beings awaken to their true nature. They may not always look the same on the surface.
3. Enlightenment / awakening / Nirvana is beyond all concepts and extremes. Language, logic, mathematics, philosophy, science, etc. - none of them can quite ferry sentient beings to the other shore. So when teachers use language and logic, they are doing their best to help sentient beings, but they will by definition "fall short". If one were to use words and scientific language to explain how an acorn becomes and oak, we will always fall short - we would have to explain the history of the entire universe and all of physics, chemistry, biology, and likely fields of study not yet discovered - it would be a book with as many pages as there are atoms in the universe, and yet we can put an acorn in soft earth and if conditions are right, a tree will appear.
4. It has been my experience that the more I've read and absorbed, the more the rough edges and seeming contradictions have fallen away. I find my faith routinely strengthened by just how many similarities I find when reading or listening to teachings from apparently widely "different" traditions.
You are very lucky to have discovered the Buddha Dharma and people to practice with. Please practice. May you awaken to your true nature.
Deep bows,
Sekishi
#satSekishi | 石志 | He/him | Better with a grain of salt, but best ignored entirely.Comment
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Welcome back Sekishi. I always enjoy reading your perspective.
Tairin
Sat today and lah泰林 - Tai Rin - Peaceful WoodsComment
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Hello there,
Coming from someone who has struggled with this question, and not just within Buddhism but within religions as well (led me to graduate with a B.A in Philosophy of Religion—as if that means anything.)
But what has helped me is a sense of “what works?”
When we look at Buddhism, we can go back to the earliest teachings where the Buddha expounded on the four noble truths. But why start with that? Why teach that first as opposed to something else that arose from his experience of enlightenment.?
Well, its because that is where we currently are. We are in suffering and we don’t see a way out, so that is where the teachings start—where the one receiving the teachings is.
With this in mind, we begin to see all of Buddhism as upaya, skill means. Where I am and what I need in this moment might be very different from where you are and what you need.
Maybe if the Buddha was to speak to me now he will tell me to go on a 6 month retreat, and maybe for you he’ll tell you to simply focus on your day to day life and treat it as practice.
If this is taken from a purely academic view, it may seem like these are two contradictory teachings, (monastic versus lay life) but in actuality, the teachings aren’t supposed to be systematic in such a way that we are to create a concert religious structure out of them (although it has been done and also works for many) but the teachings are there to help us “see.”
And what will get me to “see” and what will get you to “see” may seem contradictory from an outsider looking in, but once “seen” we will see that it was all a set of skillful means to get us back exactly where we have always been.
Gassho
Sat todayHumbly,
清竜 Seiryu
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Hi Seiryu! Still playing the guitar (cuatro)?
Gassho, J
STLahALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLEComment
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Wow! This is fantastic! I could listen to it all day.Hi Seiryu! Still playing the guitar (cuatro)?
Gassho, J
STLah
Gasho, Jishin, __/stlah\__Comment
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The ultimate goal is happiness.. no more no less. Buddhism is a way of acheiving inner peace and happiness. That you are asking and meditating on these questions indicates you are on the right path. It is about the goal of sorting out your mind and finding peace, not doctrine. My advice on where to go is to meditate and look through the past difficulties of your life. One at a time. Look at everything that led to them and came from them. Look at each persons actions and why they did what they did. Take your time to delve deeply and find your own answers to these. Once you understand why people do what they do you discover that everyone is very similar at heart. Not many want to suffer or be in pain. People do the best they can with the information they have at the time and their reasons, weather right or wrong, are not always known to us, moulded by experiences and thoughts. Look over the events of your past and present and see how everything is connected. We are in an age where information is everywhere and so much of it that we need to take time to process experiences and information. Take time to meditate deeply on your thoughts and information and seek out the base truths, the ones that have been thought all the way through and challenge those as much as possible until you are guarenteed of their truth. Even then go back and review and challenge even your most basic assumptions and beliefs. But to tackle in more detail your post.. i cannot say much about celibacy except that it allows one to focus on other things like finding enlightenment, without the distraction of sex and the resulting trouble that comes from it. However, while it would be good for all people to find peace and end suffering from war and greed and anger etc. There has to be realism. Not everyone will or should be celibate and life should procreate like it has for billions of years. Liberation of all beings is a great idea and a worthy goal but its simply one process in balance, its a long process that may never fully happen but we do what we can. Perhaps one day everyone will live happy and peaceful lives without anger or fear or greed but its a long way off if it ever comes. Finding peace and understanding for yourself is the goal. As you work to improve yourself and live happier and healthier and more sustainably and mindfully your life will slowly change around you. Buddhism and zen will guide you through the storms of life and as you go through life and practice, the parts that seem confusing will make more and more sense. As you find answers and wisdom you will, naturally and maybe unknowingly, change the world and those around you, often for the better. Find peace within yourself, and the world around you will grow brighter. I do not know if this is the message others have but this is what i have found from my own life and experiences. Do not worryabout doctrine and theory as much as finding your own inner peace and true understanding of the world. You read the basics but in the end you have to experience the stuff to truly understand it rather then just knowing it. For example I had an aunt that was consumed by greed and fear and although she had wealth (teachers pension). She was always paranoid and miserable. The happiest person recorded in the world is a buddhist monk who has very little possessions. (Look up happiest man in the world). I live in a 27 foot rv with two other people and got rid of a lot of stuff when we downsized from a 2 story big house but i found i dont need a lot of stuff and we have been very happy living this way. The goal in my opinion is to find true inner peace and self improvement.
P.s. it is 2am right now for me so if something here is incorrect or misinformed or arrogant or anything let me know.
Gassho
David
Sat todayComment
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Hi David,
Thank you for your lovely and heartfelt reflection and enthusiasm and for responding so completely to Joshua's post! I do have a quibble though. Perhaps it is just semantics, but I'm not sure Buddhist practice promises all of the things you are asking of it.
Peace? Yes. Happiness? Dukka / suffering hides in happiness as much as sadness IMHO. Happiness and sadness create each other - they are peaks and troughs of the same wave. There is a way beyond / through both.
Peace? Yes.
True understanding of the world? I'm not sure so. Intimate understanding of how we create the world - maybe. Intimate understanding of the depth of mystery that is the world - definitely.
Peace? Yes.
Self improvement? How about letting go of the idea of self completely - no "self" anywhere you look and nowhere for it to hide. But yes, somehow being a little better person in the midst of no self too. 
But these are my views. Perhaps they are mistaken.
Gassho,
Sekishi
#satSekishi | 石志 | He/him | Better with a grain of salt, but best ignored entirely.Comment
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Hi Joshua,
Zen Buddhism is super confusing at first because all schools, even when they all practice the Buddhadharma, they all take different stances on topics like rebirth or celibacy.
Like others have said, you need not to worry too much on finding an intellectual understanding of things, but you should spend more time sitting zazen. Most of your answers will come when you let go of the questions themselves.
I would add too that your path doesn't mean you have to go about Buddhism by yourself. This will only create more conflict and confusion. You need to settle on a sangha and follow a teacher. Then stay for a couple of years and then decide if that's what you want.
As you can see, our teacher here is very open and sometimes too avant garde in many ideas, but that's what this world needs. But you'll have to decide. All you have to do is to follow his suggestions and put them to the test. In the meanwhile, go sit some zazen
Gassho,
Kyonin
Sat/LAHHondō Kyōnin
奔道 協忍Comment
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Yes, as Sekishi says, Buddhists tend to have a subtle view of "happiness." Many modern Teachers, if you look closely, are actually doing a bit of "bate and switch" on their use of "happiness," which turns out to be much the same as the "joyous and content to be joyful, joyous and content to be sad, joyous and content to be healthy, joyous and content to be sick sometimes" message that you hear around our Sangha quite often. I have spoken about this and all the Dalai Lama's books on "happiness":
By the way, we don't look at past difficulties during Zazen, and just let everything be in radical equanimity. That is not the time for intentional analysis like that. After sitting is fine, but even then, see what happens if one does so with the equanimity and acceptance that one encountered in Shikantaza.The Tibetans tend to speak of "Happiness" quite a bit in their books and talks ... but when looked at closely, it is much the same as the subtle Joy and Peace that we speak of in the Zen corner of the woods ... a Joy that holds comfortably the happy times and sad times, a Peace that is wholly all life's many pieces.
I feel that westerners are too much focused on feeling good, attaining and winning. They need to know more the equanimity of sometimes not feeling good and sometimes losing.
I sometimes think that the Tibetans writers chose the word "Happiness" in their literature to impress Westerners. The problem is that some folks may hear that and think that they are going to find the key to 24/7 "laughing gas" happiness ... or that "happiness" is being used to mean "feeling happy," when the real meaning is more a message of acceptance, equanimity and stoic balance and calm. Many people are disappointed when in fact what is delivered is something much more subtle (though fathomlessly richer). I once wrote ...
Even in Tibetan Buddhism's emphasis on "happiness" ... such words might disguise the real teaching of the Dalai Lama and most Tibetan Teachers I know (same message as here at Treeleaf, in fact) that the point of this Practice is not the attaining of a happy happy ha ha happy happiness all the time (I have never met such a constantly giddy Tibetan teacher, and who would want such a state ... like only watching the comedy movies and never the drama!), but of a certain subtle Happiness (big "H") that transcends AND yet fully contains both the happy times and the sad, smiles and tears, the rainy days and sunny days, as judged by small human eyes in this life of Samsara. I do not think they are teaching people to feel happy that their mother died or tickled that there is a war somewhere in the world ... but a Boundless Joy and Buddha's Smile that shines through all that life can dish out. It is more about peace and equanimity, acceptance and a willingness to be sad and to lose sometimes.
A Buddha's Happiness transcends and holds small human "happy and sad".
All beings are already liberated and always have it but, alas, most do not seem to realize so.
Gassho, J
Sat TodayLAHLast edited by Jundo; 07-10-2019, 02:06 AM.ALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLEComment
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Hello Everyone,
While I've been checking in on this thread frequently and reading the very on the point advice, I haven't been active myself since recently after making the post. Through both long and short posts, my 'crisis' has been brought to its core and explained thoroughly. I wanted to express my gratitude for all of the people that have commented here and all that will later. It was a very interesting experience to see how I created this problem for myself and how quickly it disappeared after I stopped reading so much and then came back when I followed the questions that arose in my head. I especially wanted to point out the usage of skillful means, which I think is a major answer to the problem I originally posted about, and was demonstrated beautifully in the responses I received.
I will be sure to return to this post when I run into this problem again, as I surely will. One observation of my own, while it might not be completely accurate, is about how the Buddha actually delivered his message, which eventually became the materials I read to construct this 'problem.' When the Buddha taught, he taught to direct problems and people, and almost certainly never intended for what he taught to be learned as a list of correct/Buddhist views, but as guidance on the path towards Dharma. Or so that's how I currently see it.
Gassho,
Joshua
Sat TodayComment
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Thank you for your insight. I should clarify a few terms used in my post. When I said happiness I am referring to the ability to choose your own mood including feeling joy if you wish it, seperate from MOST external influences. Perhaps a permanent contentment would be a better term. The line "buddhists tend to have a subtle view of "happiness." Many modern Teachers, if you look closely, are actually doing a bit of "bate and switch" on their use of "happiness," which turns out to be much the same as the "joyous and content to be joyful, joyous and content to be sad, joyous and content to be healthy, joyous and content to be sick sometimes" this gives me much to meditate on, thank you Jundo. Also i dont know how to do the green quote thingy, I shall look it up asap.
When i say true understanding of the world I am referring more to being able to see the interconnectedness in all things and understanding how everything affects one another, for the most part and an understanding of base undeniable and thoughroughly tested thruths that help you figure out and understand the rest, as well as what you said. As for self improvement, the concept of no self may be hard to grasp for those who havent gotten there yet and so it is easier to talk using self language rather than no self language, for example saying that I have done or said something rather than trying to explain quantum theory. Those who arent there yet see themselves and others as "self" and "individual" and so learn from these terms. I admit i do sometimes feel a bit awkward using "I" and "me" knowing this. Working to improve what one calls self, will improve the aoe anyway. These posts have given me much to think about. Thank you.Last edited by serenewolf; 07-10-2019, 03:10 AM.Comment
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I really don't think that is possible and, if it were possible, I kind of think that it would not be fully human. Something like only watching Disney movies all the time without the drama and tragedies. Or taking happiness drugs.
I would much rather be content to be happy sometimes, and content to be heart broken sometimes. I am at peace with being content sometimes, and at peace with not being content sometimes (content about not always being content
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At the still point amid all life's ups and downs, that is the place we sit.
Yes, we do develop more control, and learn to not buy into all the bullshit and clutter in the attack between the ears. That is so.
Gassho, Jundo
STLahALL OF LIFE IS OUR TEMPLEComment
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Joshua, glad to hear you are doing better.
4. It has been my experience that the more I've read and absorbed, the more the rough edges and seeming contradictions have fallen away.Couldn't agree more. I have now read at least 10 books from very different authors, most of them from Zen lineages but not all. The similarities are uncanny. It's like a million fingers pointing at the moon. They're all pointing at the same thing, but they are not giving you the thing itself, because they can't. The most they can do is point in their own way, from their own experiences and limited perspectives, with words we might prefer or not prefer. We have to do the work to get to the moon ourselves. Once you've caught a glimpse of the moon, you'll likely figure out the same thing, that they're all pointing at the thing you just saw.You read the basics but in the end you have to experience the stuff to truly understand it rather then just knowing it.
Gassho,
Kenny
Sat TodayComment
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Kenny you've explained that perfectly. Those fingers have been pointing since ages ago. Thank you.
Gassho
David
SatComment
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