vimalakirti

[Aurkihnowe]

i am slowly placing myself in a buddhist mindset, with emphasis on the mahayana (with occasional detours into the other schools), but am in no position or disposition to become an anchorite...i am interested in living in the world and practicing the dharma while remaining fully engaged (in a relative way) with the world/samsara like everyone here, and therefore am interested in the vimalakirti sutra.....where does this sutra fit in the zen tradition, i ask....and, does anybody know of the best translation to pick up?

gassho

richard

sat today

[Ryushi]

"Anchorite". Had to look that one up.

[Jakuden]

Haha thanks Todd Saved me a couple of clicks to look it up myself!!

I don't know the answer to this, but here is a link to Jundo's Bodhisattva thread: https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/show...ht=vimalakirti

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH

[Jundo]

Hi Richard,

Yes, Vimalakirti, the great lay person with family and business who bested all the superstar Buddhist Arhats and Bodhisattvas who he encountered, is highly prized in the Zen and general Mahayana world. Dogen ran a little cold on him when Dogen was in his "monk is the way" mood, but also seemed to love Vimalakirti when he was in his "this Practice is for everyone" mood (Dogen had his moods. I like the "this Practice is for everyone" Dogen).

The two most popular translations, both available online, by Prof. Robert Thurman (Uma's dad!) or Prof. Burton Watson are both good and not that far apart. I think that the latter is from Chinese, the former from the Tibetan, as I recall. Yes, he is included in our "Whattsa Who'sa Bodhisattva?" series.

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?17227-Whattsa-Who-sa-Bodhisattva-%28A-Sit-a-Long-Series%29&p=248708&viewfull=1#post248708

Gassho, Jundo

SatTodayLAH

[Jundo]

ps- A nice little paper summarizing the Sutra here (putting it in a nutshell, which is something the Vimalakirti could do with the whole universe) ...

http://mnzencenter.org/pdf/Vimalakirti.pdf

[Jakuden]

ps- A nice little paper summarizing the Sutra here (putting it in a nutshell, which is something the Vimalakirti could do with the whole universe) ...

http://mnzencenter.org/pdf/Vimalakirti.pdf

Thank you this is great!

Gassho,
Jakuden
SatToday/LAH

[Tokan]

Thanks Richard for starting this thread. The tension in me for not becoming a monastic when I had the chance left an ugly residue in my practice for years. Now, I look to the arisen situation to teach me what I need to know. For example, being a parent has taught me things that being a non-parent couldn't. Being a non-monastic has taught me things that being a monastic couldn't, but then being a monastic would have taught me other things. Like body and mind, I like to try and let the distinction 'drop away'. I've downloaded the article, will read in the morning thank you.

Sat today, Leon

[Jundo]

Hi Leon and everyone,

You should know that my teacher, Nishijima, had a rather radical view on the future and meaning of Zen and Buddhist clergy. I repeat part below, from the Obituary I wrote for him. This idea is not widely accepted in the Zen or wider Buddhist world. Right now, I am party to a conversation taking place among various "lay Zen teachers" regarding how Ordained teachers at San Francisco Zen Center and other places still struggle to recognize the place of the lay teachers. In a nutshell, Nishijima wanted to step through and beyond Ordained and Lay, male or female, in the monastery and in the world.

-------------

1 – STEPPING THROUGH THE TRADITIONAL FOURFOLD CATEGORIES OF PRIEST & LAY, MALE & FEMALE: Unlike most Buddhist clergy in Asia, Japanese priests typically marry and are not celibate. Some look at this as a great failing of Japanese Buddhism, a break from 25 centuries of tradition. In Japan and the West, even some Japanese lineage priests and lay teachers themselves are unsure of their own identity and legitimacy, and of their roles compared to each other. With great wisdom, Nishijima transcended all such questions and limiting categories. He advocated a way of stepping right through and beyond the whole matter, of finding living expressions where others saw restriction, and of preserving the tradition even as things change. While he was a champion of the celibate way (Nishijima Roshi, although married, turned to a celibate lifestyle for himself upon ordination), he never felt that celibacy was the only road for all priests. Nishijima advocated a form of ordination that fully steps beyond and drops away divisions of “Priest or Lay, Male or Female”, yet allows us to fully embody and actuate each and all as the situation requires. In our lineage, we are not ashamed of nor try to hide our sexuality and worldly relationships, nor do we feel conflicted that we are “monks” with kids and mortgages. When I am a parent to my children, I am 100% that and fully there for them. When I am a worker at my job, I am that and embody such a role with sincerity and dedication. And when I am asked to step into the role of hosting zazen, offering a dharma talk, practicing and embodying our history and teachings and passing them on to others, I fully carry out and embody 100% the role of “Priest” in that moment. Whatever the moment requires: maintaining a sangha community, bestowing the Precepts, working with others to help sentient beings. The names we call ourselves do not matter. In Nishijima’s way, we do not ask and are unconcerned with whether we are “Priest” or “Lay”, for we are neither that alone, while always thoroughly both; exclusively each in purest and unadulterated form, yet wholly all at once. It is just as, in the West, we have come to step beyond the hard divisions and discriminations between “male” and “female”, recognizing that each of us may embody all manner of qualities to varying degrees as the circumstances present, and that traditional “male” and “female” stereotypes are not so clear-cut as once held. So it is with the divisions of “Priest” and “Lay”.

2 – FINDING OUR PLACE OF PRACTICE AND TRAINING “OUT IN THE WORLD”: For thousands of years, it was nearly impossible to engage in dedicated Zen practice except in a monastic setting, to access fellow practitioners, teachers and teachings, to have the time and resources and economic means to pursue serious practice, except by abandoning one’s worldly life. By economic and practical necessity, a division of “Priest” and “Lay” was maintained because someone had to grow the food to place in the monks’ bowls, earn the wealth to build great temples, have children to keep the world going into the next generation. Although Mahayana figures like Vimalakirti stood for the principle that liberation is available to all, the practical situation was that only a householder with Vimalakirti’s wealth, leisure and resources might have a real chance to do so. Now, in modern societies with better distributions of wealth (compared to the past, although we still have a long way to go), ‘leisure’ time, literacy and education, media access and means of travel and communication across distances, many of the economic and practical barriers to practice and training have been removed. This is the age when we may begin to figuratively “knock down monastery walls”, to find that Buddha’s Truths may be practiced any place, without divisions of “inside” walls or “outside”. For some of us, the family kitchen, children’s nursery, office or factory where we work diligently and hard, the hospital bed, volunteer activity or town hall are all our “monastery” and place of training. We can come to recognize the “monastery” located in buildings made of wood and tile as in some ways an expedient means, although with their own power and beauty too. There are still times when each of us can benefit from periods of withdrawal and silence, be it a sesshin or ango, or the proverbial grass hut in distant hills. Yes, this Way still needs all manner of people, each pursuing the paths of practice suited to their needs and circumstances, be they temple priests catering to the needs of their parishioners, hermits isolated in caves, celibate monks in mountain monasteries, or “out in the world” types demonstrating that all can be found right in the city streets and busy highways of this modern world. Nishijima, a zen priest yet a working man, a husband and father most of his life, stood for a dropping of “inside” and “out”. He was someone that knew the value of times of retreat, but also the constant realization of these teachings in the home, workplace and soup kitchens.

More here ...

http://sweepingzen.com/eight-ways-gudo-wafu-nishijima-will-help-change-zen-buddhism/

Gassho, J

STLah

[Tokan]

thank you Jundo

Sat today, Leon

[Kyonin]

Thank you Jundo.

It's always refreshing to read about Nishijima Roshi.

Gassho,

Kyonin
Sat/LAH

[Genjun]

The abbot of my apartment/monastery is almost 6 years old. The schedule here is intense. The discourses here are deep. It's good training.

Sat today.

[Shugen]

The abbot of my apartment/monastery is almost 6 years old. The schedule here is intense. The discourses here are deep. It's good training.

Sat today.

[emoji846]

Gassho,

Shugen

Sattoday/LAH


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[Mp]

The abbot of my apartment/monastery is almost 6 years old. The schedule here is intense. The discourses here are deep. It's good training.

Sat today.

That's awesome. =)

Gassho
Shingen

Sat/LAH

[Ryudo]

Thank you.

Gassho/SatToday