Bodhisattva Blunder

[Enjaku]

My partner was working yesterday and feeling the stress of two consecutive long days, so I spent my day thinking of ways to cheer her up and help her relax when she got in.

I prepared a nice meal, picked up some sweet treats from the Chinese bakery and welcomed her home with a glass of wine and a hot bath. It become clear after a while that she wasn't enjoying the evening, so I asked what was wrong.

It turned out in all my efforts to help, I forgot to ask the key question... what she needed! The answer was "space". It reminded me that in order to help someone, first we need to find out what they need.

Gassho,
Enjaku
Sat / LAH (well, I tried...)

[Rakurei]

Oh yes.

Or often we want to spoil our partner to show them how great of a partner we are.

Look how kind I am! Look at me! Look how great of a partner I am! Aren't I the best? I poured you wine, I ran you a bath, I cooked you food! I am the best partner! I went and bought the treats you liked! And you're STILL sad? What's wrong with you? How can you not see how great of a partner I am! I am a Bodhisattva of compassion!

..eesh.

Or often, we nurture them to get them off our case for a little bit. Here, I solved your problem - now go away lol..

We have such a funny way of making things about us, don't we? So we can get a little pat on the head.

This reminds of me the helpless flaw found within the Golden Rule - don't treat others how YOU want to be treated, how self-centered!

Treat others the way THEY want to be treated.
And also, always get off your high horse.

Gassho,

Rakurei

Sat/LAH

[Kyotai]

Thank you Enjaku. Good advice

Gassho Kyotai
ST

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[Kyonin]

Hi Enjaku,

Yes, sometimes remaining silent and giving some room to breath is more help than we can imagine.

Thank you for the reminder. Hope everything is fine now.

Gassho,

Kyonin
Sat/LAH

[Jundo]

My partner was working yesterday and feeling the stress of two consecutive long days, so I spent my day thinking of ways to cheer her up and help her relax when she got in.

I prepared a nice meal, picked up some sweet treats from the Chinese bakery and welcomed her home with a glass of wine and a hot bath. It become clear after a while that she wasn't enjoying the evening, so I asked what was wrong.

It turned out in all my efforts to help, I forgot to ask the key question... what she needed! The answer was "space". It reminded me that in order to help someone, first we need to find out what they need.

Gassho,
Enjaku
Sat / LAH (well, I tried...)

Sometimes we can't get it right, no matter our efforts and best intentions.

I am afraid that this is especially true in marriage and relationships sometimes. Even asking often will not give a clear answer, assuming the person asked knows theirself what they want!

You tried your best, and went to a lot of effort, and that says a lot.

Gassho, Jundo Husband

SatTodayLAH

[Joyo]

Ahh, your partner must be an introvert =)

But your efforts were very kind.


Gassho,
Joyo
sat today/lah

[Enjaku]

Oh yes.

Or often we want to spoil our partner to show them how great of a partner we are.

Look how kind I am! Look at me! Look how great of a partner I am! Aren't I the best? I poured you wine, I ran you a bath, I cooked you food!

Haha. It's true!
I wander how much compassion is primarily motivated by the desire to be seen as a noble, compassionate person... This anxiety came up for some people (including me) when we were initially discussing the LAH concept. In the end, I think we should endeavour to be empathic and helpful, while keeping an eye on our ego...

Gassho,
Enjaku
Sat LAH

[Eishuu]

Awww, how sweet. But yes, asking what someone actually needs is often a better idea. And like Jundo says, sometimes even they won't know, but providing a space where they know they can express their needs when they need to and are able is in itself a wonderful gift in itself.

Gassho
Eishuu
ST/LAH

[Eva]

Hi Enjaku,
your effort was good, if little bit misdirected .. So the flowers and dinner were really beautiful lessons, hopefully tasty too!

Lately so I have been doing something I never considered capable of or even needed doing - listening to others .
I found out that in every situation , where "me" was involved, it tended to be stressful . I have dropped the "me" and everything just flows effortlessly . And this turns out, is also enabling me to really truly listening to what others are saying . Because we humans often do not know what and how we express something . especially when emotions are involved or there are needs that are difficult to express . And because I'm not fixed to any result what "I" would deem as appropriate or pleasant or doable , I have just listened and seen things from the others point of view .
I'm so thankful to be able to do this, as much as possible (and sometimes it is not so easy if at all) - to listen without any expectation, with no hurry and with no "me" . open mind=open ears

Wishing everyone beautiful day/evening
Gassho,
eva
isattoday and also LAH

[Jundo]

Hi,

After 27 years of marriage, I want to tell a story about "really listening."

One time, I faced a similar situation with my wife. I asked her what she needed to recover from a hard day, and she said that she really needed a little "space." I gave it to her.

A few hours later, she seemed peeved at me. I asked why.

It turns out that, when she told me that she needed "space" I hadn't really heard that she wanted me to not give her "space."

Enjaku did a nice thing. Maybe either giving "space" or not giving "space" would not have helped his wife. Maybe something else was bothering her altogether, and even she did not know. These things are relationship mysteries. Hey, Enjaku, good for you, why be so hard on yourself? Many husbands wouldn't have done all that. Maybe we should wag a finger at his wife for not recognizing his efforts!

(I would say the same thing if a wife tried something nice for her husband that flopped).

Even in trying to be helpful out in the world, in any project or social cause, we do the best we can. Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't. I don't think it is a matter of "really listening," because quite often what one hears is not the full picture. Sometimes I "really listen," and what is being said is far from the background truth. Sometimes what is being said is the very opposite of the real truth, or the real motivations are unknown to all parties!

I also think it okay for a Bodhisattva ... or a thoughtful husband ... to feel good about trying, and about himself. Why not? The Golden Rule is not bad, because often we can't tell what the heck the other person needs, so simply must guess.

Couples just need to be patient with each other, because frequently we are just irrational creatures of changing moods, who don't outselves know half the reasons we do the stuff we do. I have been married for 27 years because the wife and me know to go with the flow, not to mention that she is REALLY patient.

Sorry if I am against the stream on some of the comments here.

Gassho, J (as husband more than Zen guy).

SatTodayLAH

[Jishin]

Bodhisattva Blunder

Hi,

As Jundo points out just listening and giving someone our full attention is priceless.

Gasho, Jishin, _/st\_ , LAH

[Jundo]

Let me add ...

I like to joke that I handle the easy questions ... like "the meaning of Time" and "are we One with the Universe." However, stuff about marriage and relationships is a mystery!

So, don't listen to me on this. I am just talking as one husband, and a guy.

However, yes, always appreciate your spouse and our ham-fingered good intentions!

Gassho, Jundo

SatTodayLAH

[Seishin]

Its space Jundo but not as we know it. After 40 years of marriage I still think I get it right only to be wrong. I listen only not to hear. But like the rest of those here I keep trying, listening and learning and occasionally I'll get it right.

Made me think of this

[Geika]

Listening is so important, but about relationships I often read that communication is number one! <3

Gassho, sat today, lah

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