Buddha-Basics (Part IV) — Viewing Right

[Tom]

wisdom.org publications has decently-priced ebooks, SeaChel.

[Tom]

Jundo,
How much does a command of Japanese or Chinese help with learning the teachings? And do you need to study the old dialects, the way one would with Beowulf or struggle with Chaucer?
Gassho
Tom
Sat.

[Jundo]

Jundo,
How much does a command of Japanese or Chinese help with learning the teachings? And do you need to study the old dialects, the way one would with Beowulf or struggle with Chaucer?
Gassho
Tom
Sat.

Oh, no! There is more available in English now, and better translations, then in the entire history of Buddhism for 2500 years. I do not exaggerate. The old Chinese, Japanese, Sanskrit or Pali words are good to look up the odd bit of history now and then, but these days one can find the translation for most things already artfully done.

I am glad I speak Japanese, but I would not call it necessary. Maybe 99% of the Zen Teachers in the west these days do not.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Tom]

Still, it must be nice to look up old Japanese sutras and texts and be able to read them. As for the translations in English, my what times we live in and my what a debt we have to the first generation of teachers and translators in the last 200 years.
Tom
Gassho,
Sat today.

[Jundo]

Still, it must be nice to look up old Japanese sutras and texts and be able to read them. As for the translations in English, my what times we live in and my what a debt we have to the first generation of teachers and translators in the last 200 years.
Tom
Gassho,
Sat today.

Before Nishijima Roshi translated the Shobogenzo into English, he first had published a translation into Japanese! (Yes, from classical Japanese which is almost impossible for Japanese to read today, into modern Japanese). Classical Japanese for modern Japanese folks is even harder than a modern American reading Shakespeare without footnotes, and even in modern Japanese Dogen is ... well ... not a walk in the park. And, of course, even back in Dogen's day, the average Japanese struggled to understand Chinese in much the same way that you and I might struggle as English speakers with French (have to guess at the words which are vaguely similar). That assumes, of course, that folks were even literate in their own language! What is more, almost nobody in Japan or China understood Sanskrit or Pali, so they could only read mediocre translations of the few Indian texts available.

And they didn't have big libraries of cheap paperbacks, not to mention the internet to download!

In other words ... you and I have it so much better than Buddhist monks of the past ever did.

And, of course, there is that whole Face of our Way that is beyond words and texts anyway.

Gassho, J

SatToday

[Budo-Dan]

Is it OK to keep a note book? I'm writing things down to better learn and remember these lessons for future reference. Once again...thank you!

Dan

[Jundo]

Is it OK to keep a note book? I'm writing things down to better learn and remember these lessons for future reference. Once again...thank you!

Dan

Of course!

In Zen, we "burn all the books." But that just means that there is a time to study and read them, a time to put them down and just sit or work, days to burn the books, days to reconstitute the ashes and read them again.

Even when reading or studying, do not get trapped in the words and philosophy, making it just an intellectual idea. See through the words and live the Practice.

Gassho, J

SatTodayLAH

[Budo-Dan]

SatToday

[Teiro]

Funnily enough I came across something about learning how to play the guitar yesterday. There are basically two kinds of ways on how to learn to play. One is the “classical” way. You learn mostly by and through music theory and sheet reading. The other one is to learn by ear and what others show you. Both will learn how to play the guitar eventually. However, both will probably be limited in how to express themselves on the guitar. The classically trained players may have problems to improvise, the others may lack the ability to tackle things they’ve never encountered before and cannot teach themselves by reading sheet music and so on. The most accomplished players are those who can do both. They know the theory behind what they hear and play and therefore can express themselves much better than any of the aforementioned.

I think it’s the same with reading books on Buddhism and “just” sitting. Reading gives depth to what you do.

Sorry for the long post...

Gassho
Teiro

Sat/Lah

[Tairin]

Nice analogy Teiro. As a self taught guitarist who after years of stubbornness decided to learn a little theory I can very much relate to what you said.


Tairin
Sat today and lah

[Kenku]

Thank you Jundo.

I have read sometimes the word "Upaya" used to describe Buddhist teachings which is translated as "expedient means" but which I interpret as "useful fictions". That is, ideas and concepts valuable not because they are truths but because they provide a framework to make sense of our experience while remembering that making sense is "making", not "discovering".

Gassho,
Mark.

Sat today and LAHed.

[Jundo]

Thank you Jundo.

I have read sometimes the word "Upaya" used to describe Buddhist teachings which is translated as "expedient means" but which I interpret as "useful fictions". That is, ideas and concepts valuable not because they are truths but because they provide a framework to make sense of our experience while remembering that making sense is "making", not "discovering".

Gassho,
Mark.

Sat today and LAHed.

We just recently had a discussion of this and, in a nutshell, my opinion is that "Upaya" is any method ... poetry or dance or parables or wondrous images or simplified versions and similes and metaphors ... that help to get the message across and encourage folks:

How much of dharma is upaya?

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?18066-How-much-of-dharma-is-upaya&p=268446&viewfull=1#post268446

I like your very flexible outlook, Mark.

Gassho, J
STLah

[Kenku]

We just recently had a discussion of this and, in a nutshell, my opinion is that "Upaya" is any method ... poetry or dance or parables or wondrous images or simplified versions and similes and metaphors ... that help to get the message across and encourage folks:

How much of dharma is upaya?

https://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?18066-How-much-of-dharma-is-upaya&p=268446&viewfull=1#post268446

I like your very flexible outlook, Mark.

Gassho, J
STLah

Thanks (I think) for pointing me to that discussion. I learn from that that seems best not to over-analyse or over-intellectualise but to validate? on the zafu. Now I have to read "On ‘A Picture of a Rice Cake’". This site is like wikipedia.

Gassho,
Mark.

Sat today & lah.

[BriJolieG]

Thank you for this you for this teaching.

[Luke108]

Thank you Jundo,

Sat Today