Feb. 6-7, 2026 -OUR MONTHLY 3-hour Treeleaf ZAZENKAI- Changcha's Ten Mysterious Talks

**Jundo** · 02-06-2026, 09:05 AM

For today's talk, we will dive deep into a once classic text of Soto Zen in China, long forgotten until recently revived ...

The "Ten Mysterious Talks," or "Ten Talks of Unfathomable Depths" (十玄談), by the 10th Century Soto (Caodong) Master, Tong'an Changcha (同安常察, Dōan Jōsatsu).

We will explore the first of the ten. (Translation by Daigaku Rumme):

Ten Verses of Unfathomable Depth

1. The Mind Seal
I ask you, “What does the Mind Seal look like?”
And “What sort of person dares to transmit it?”
Throughout the ages, it has remained firm and unshaken.
As soon as you call something the Mind Seal, it is already meaningless.
You must know that in essence all things originate from infinite emptiness.
You can compare it to a lotus flower in a red-hot kiln.
Don’t say that a free and empty mind is the Way;
A free and empty mind is still separated from it by a great barrier.

① 心印
問君心印作何顔
心印誰人敢授傳
歷劫坦然無異色
呼爲心印早虛言
須知本自靈空性
將喩紅爐火裏蓮
莫謂無心云是道
無心猶隔一重關

Sekkei Harada comments ...

These Ten Verses of Unfathomable Depth ... were written by Master Tong’an Changcha and represent a work of pure Sōtō Zen. The first five verses set forth the principles of Sōtō Zen, while the second five are concerned with matters of practice. Thus, taken together, these verses encapsulate the whole teaching of Sōtō Zen. However, most people—even those who have been practicing Zen for a long time—may not be familiar with them. ... The Ten Verses of Unfathomable Depth is comprised, as its title suggests, of ten verses. The first five verses—called “The Mind Seal,” “The Mind of the Enlightened Ones,” “The Unfathomable Function,” “The Transcendent within Dust and Dirt,” and “The Buddhist Teaching,” respectively—deal with theoretical aspects of Sōtō Zen. The second f ive—called “Returning Home,” “The Song of Not Returning Home,” “The Revolving Function,” “Changing Ranks,” and “Before the Rank of the Absolute,” respectively—are concerned with practical matters. The word “depth” (xuan) in the title, which is also found in Laozi’s Daodejing in the phrase “deepest depth, the gate to all wonders,” signifies something very profound: a bottomless depth. This is not a depth that we can imagine. It is so deep that it can contain everything in the world and yet have room to spare.

**Taiji** · 02-06-2026, 11:29 PM

Circumstances are such that I won't be there tonight, but will sit with you all later.

Gassho,
Taiji
Sat/LAH Today

**Jundo** · 02-07-2026, 07:29 AM

The old Sutta reference I mention in my talk is, for example, Itv 43 Ajāta Sutta ...

“There is, monks, an unborn, unbecome, unmade, unconditioned. If, monks there were not that unborn, unbecome, unmade, unconditioned, you could not know an escape here from the born, become, made, and conditioned. But because there is an unborn, unbecome, unmade, unconditioned, therefore you do know an escape from the born, become, made, and conditioned.”

LINK

Gassho, J
stlah

**nima** · 02-07-2026, 06:02 PM

Many thanks, the "Ten Mysterious Talks" are very beautiful and moving, it seems to be a combination of texts from the Dao De Jing and haiku.

Gassho,
Sat/LAH

**Tairin** · 02-08-2026, 01:54 PM

Thank you everyone. I sat with you this morning

Tairin
sat today and lah

**Chikyou** · 02-08-2026, 07:01 PM

Is there a place where I can find all of these compiled together?

Gassho,
SatLah,
Chikyō

**Jundo** · 02-10-2026, 01:49 AM

Originally posted by Chikyou

Is there a place where I can find all of these compiled together?

Gassho,
SatLah,
Chikyō

Here you are (Daigaku Rumme translation) ...

~~~

Ten Verses of Unfathomable Depth

1. The Mind Seal
I ask you, “What does the Mind Seal look like?” And “What sort of person dares to transmit it?” Throughout the ages, it has remained firm and unshaken. As soon as you call something the Mind Seal, it is already meaningless. You must know that in essence all things originate from infinite emptiness. You can compare it to a lotus flower in a red-hot kiln. Don’t say that a free and empty mind is the Way; A free and empty mind is still separated from it by a great barrier.

2. The Mind of the Enlightened Ones
This mind is like emptiness, but it isn’t empty. How could the unfathomable function ever degenerate to being the result of achievement? The bodhisattvas at the three stages of wisdom have still not clarified this. And how can the higher ranks of bodhisattvas ever reach it? The golden carp that has passed through the net remains trapped in the water. But the stone horse still on the way leaves its sand cage suddenly. Why have the meaning of Bodhidharma coming from the West explained in every detail? Don’t ask about the coming from the West, nor about the East.

3. The Unfathomable Function
You cannot rely on looking far ahead to the end of the universe. And why would you tie yourself down to tainted worldliness? Essentially, the miraculous body is not bound anywhere. It is already throughout the whole body, so what other traces could there be? A single efficacious word transcends the multitudes. It is far beyond the Three Vehicles and does not require cultivation. Shake off your hands and get away from the sages of all ages. Then your path of return will resemble an ox in the midst of fire.

4. The Transcendent within Dust and Dirt
That which is impure is impure by itself; that which is pure is pure by itself. Highest wisdom and delusion are likewise empty and even. Who could say that nobody can appreciate Bianhe’s jade? I say that the jewel of the black dragon shines everywhere. Only when the myriad dharmas disappear does the whole thing appear. The Three Vehicles split up and assumed only provisional names. Truly outstanding people have determination that knows no bounds. Do not try to go where the buddhas have already gone.

5. The Buddhist Teaching
The Three Vehicles spoke golden words one after another. But the buddhas of the past, present, and future only declared the same thing. In the beginning, when they expounded the reality of skandhas and then complete emptiness, everyone grew attached to it. Later, when they negated both reality and emptiness, everyone discarded it again. The complete treasury of sutras in the Dragon Palace is meant to be prescriptions. Even the Buddha’s last teaching does not reach the unfathomable. If even one deluded thought arises in the world of true purity, This already means spending eight thousand years in the world of human beings.

6. The Song of Returning Home
Don’t be distracted by the King of Emptiness when you are still on the Way. You must drive your staff forward, moving on until you reach home. If you travel for a long time like clouds and water, don’t get attached to it. Even in the deep recesses of snowy mountains, don’t forget your mission. Ah! I regretted that in past days my face was like jade. And I lamented that at the time of my return my hair had turned white. Returning to my old home with dangling arms, there was no one who recognized me. Also, I had nothing to offer my parents.

7. The Song of Not Returning Home
Having the intention of going to the source, of returning to the origin, is already a mistake. Essentially, there is nowhere to settle down, no place to call one’s home. The ancient path through the pines is covered with deep snow. The long range of mountain peaks is furthermore blocked by clouds. When host and guest are tranquil and serene, everything is incongruous. When lord and vassal are united, there is wrong in the midst of right. How will you sing the song of returning home? In bright moonlight, the dead tree is blooming in front of the hall.

8. The Revolving Function
It is still dangerous even inside the castle of nirvana. Strangers come across each other without appointment. People call someone who provisionally puts on a dirty robe “a buddha.” But if someone wears precious clothes, what should you call him? In the middle of the night, the wooden man puts on shoes and leaves. At dawn, the stone woman puts on a hat and goes home. An ancient emerald pool, the moon in the empty sky. Screening and filtering over and over to catch the moon, for the first time you will really know.

9. Changing Ranks
Growing hair and horns, you enter town, Resembling a blue lotus flower blooming in the midst of fire. All afflictions become like rain and dew in the vast sea. All ignorance becomes like clouds and thunder on a mountain. You completely blow out the furnace below the cauldron of hell, Smashing to pieces a forest of swords and a mountain of daggers with a single shout. Even golden chains cannot hold you back at the entrance. Going into the realm of other beings, you transmigrate for a while.

10. Before the Rank of the Absolute
In front of many dead trees and steep boulders, there are many wrong tracks heading off course. Those travelers who have reached this place all trip and stumble. A crane stands in the snow but does not have the same color. The bright moon and the flower of reeds do not really resemble each other. “I’m finished, I’m finished, I’m finished!” When you think so, you cannot really be finished. If you say, “This is it! This is the ultimate source!” you also need a good shout. From the bottom of your heart, you play a melody on the harp with no strings. How would it be possible to grasp the moonlight shining in the empty sky?

**Kotei** · 02-10-2026, 07:44 AM

I needed to split this in two days.
Thank you everyone for sitting together!
Bows,
Kotei sat/lah today.

**Shui_Di** · 02-11-2026, 05:16 PM

Thank you Jundo, I just sat tonight.

Lotus is fire, and fire is lotus.

And also lotus is lotus and it is infinite lotus.
And fire is fire and it is infinite fire.

Hmmm.. I think it is time for me to sit on fire ????

Keep on fire everyone.

Gassho, Mujo
Stlah

**Chikyou** · 02-14-2026, 03:16 PM

Originally posted by Jundo

Here you are (Daigaku Rumme translation) ...

~~~

Ten Verses of Unfathomable Depth

1. The Mind Seal
I ask you, “What does the Mind Seal look like?” And “What sort of person dares to transmit it?” Throughout the ages, it has remained firm and unshaken. As soon as you call something the Mind Seal, it is already meaningless. You must know that in essence all things originate from infinite emptiness. You can compare it to a lotus flower in a red-hot kiln. Don’t say that a free and empty mind is the Way; A free and empty mind is still separated from it by a great barrier.

2. The Mind of the Enlightened Ones
This mind is like emptiness, but it isn’t empty. How could the unfathomable function ever degenerate to being the result of achievement? The bodhisattvas at the three stages of wisdom have still not clarified this. And how can the higher ranks of bodhisattvas ever reach it? The golden carp that has passed through the net remains trapped in the water. But the stone horse still on the way leaves its sand cage suddenly. Why have the meaning of Bodhidharma coming from the West explained in every detail? Don’t ask about the coming from the West, nor about the East.

3. The Unfathomable Function
You cannot rely on looking far ahead to the end of the universe. And why would you tie yourself down to tainted worldliness? Essentially, the miraculous body is not bound anywhere. It is already throughout the whole body, so what other traces could there be? A single efficacious word transcends the multitudes. It is far beyond the Three Vehicles and does not require cultivation. Shake off your hands and get away from the sages of all ages. Then your path of return will resemble an ox in the midst of fire.

4. The Transcendent within Dust and Dirt
That which is impure is impure by itself; that which is pure is pure by itself. Highest wisdom and delusion are likewise empty and even. Who could say that nobody can appreciate Bianhe’s jade? I say that the jewel of the black dragon shines everywhere. Only when the myriad dharmas disappear does the whole thing appear. The Three Vehicles split up and assumed only provisional names. Truly outstanding people have determination that knows no bounds. Do not try to go where the buddhas have already gone.

5. The Buddhist Teaching
The Three Vehicles spoke golden words one after another. But the buddhas of the past, present, and future only declared the same thing. In the beginning, when they expounded the reality of skandhas and then complete emptiness, everyone grew attached to it. Later, when they negated both reality and emptiness, everyone discarded it again. The complete treasury of sutras in the Dragon Palace is meant to be prescriptions. Even the Buddha’s last teaching does not reach the unfathomable. If even one deluded thought arises in the world of true purity, This already means spending eight thousand years in the world of human beings.

6. The Song of Returning Home
Don’t be distracted by the King of Emptiness when you are still on the Way. You must drive your staff forward, moving on until you reach home. If you travel for a long time like clouds and water, don’t get attached to it. Even in the deep recesses of snowy mountains, don’t forget your mission. Ah! I regretted that in past days my face was like jade. And I lamented that at the time of my return my hair had turned white. Returning to my old home with dangling arms, there was no one who recognized me. Also, I had nothing to offer my parents.

7. The Song of Not Returning Home
Having the intention of going to the source, of returning to the origin, is already a mistake. Essentially, there is nowhere to settle down, no place to call one’s home. The ancient path through the pines is covered with deep snow. The long range of mountain peaks is furthermore blocked by clouds. When host and guest are tranquil and serene, everything is incongruous. When lord and vassal are united, there is wrong in the midst of right. How will you sing the song of returning home? In bright moonlight, the dead tree is blooming in front of the hall.

8. The Revolving Function
It is still dangerous even inside the castle of nirvana. Strangers come across each other without appointment. People call someone who provisionally puts on a dirty robe “a buddha.” But if someone wears precious clothes, what should you call him? In the middle of the night, the wooden man puts on shoes and leaves. At dawn, the stone woman puts on a hat and goes home. An ancient emerald pool, the moon in the empty sky. Screening and filtering over and over to catch the moon, for the first time you will really know.

9. Changing Ranks
Growing hair and horns, you enter town, Resembling a blue lotus flower blooming in the midst of fire. All afflictions become like rain and dew in the vast sea. All ignorance becomes like clouds and thunder on a mountain. You completely blow out the furnace below the cauldron of hell, Smashing to pieces a forest of swords and a mountain of daggers with a single shout. Even golden chains cannot hold you back at the entrance. Going into the realm of other beings, you transmigrate for a while.

10. Before the Rank of the Absolute
In front of many dead trees and steep boulders, there are many wrong tracks heading off course. Those travelers who have reached this place all trip and stumble. A crane stands in the snow but does not have the same color. The bright moon and the flower of reeds do not really resemble each other. “I’m finished, I’m finished, I’m finished!” When you think so, you cannot really be finished. If you say, “This is it! This is the ultimate source!” you also need a good shout. From the bottom of your heart, you play a melody on the harp with no strings. How would it be possible to grasp the moonlight shining in the empty sky?

Thank you! These are beautiful, and extremely dense. I feel like I could easily spend a lifetime pondering each one.

Do you know why they “fell out of fashion” so to speak?

Gassho,
SatLah,
Chikyō

**Jundo** · 02-14-2026, 03:38 PM

Originally posted by Chikyou

Do you know why they “fell out of fashion” so to speak?

Gassho,
SatLah,
Chikyō

No, but no reason, I think. Other things come along, people and tastes change, koans and teachers and customs change in popularity or content, like with popular songs or slang or any old thing.

Gassho, J
stlah

**Shinshi** · 02-14-2026, 05:07 PM

I finished sitting with you all yesterday and it was lovely. I really enjoyed the talk and I am fascinated to see where these 10 Verses of Unfathomable Depth take us. Looking forward to the next talks.

Gassho, Shinshi

SAT-lah

Feb. 6-7, 2026 -OUR MONTHLY 3-hour Treeleaf ZAZENKAI- Changcha's Ten Mysterious Talks

Feb. 6-7, 2026 -OUR MONTHLY 3-hour Treeleaf ZAZENKAI- Changcha's Ten Mysterious Talks

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