The Cult of Self

[Myozan Kodo]

Hi all,
On Facebook I follow a feed from disciples of Thich Nhat Hanh. Everyday they post messages like "Make Time For Yourself; You Are Important" and "Forgive Yourself". So many of the quotes are self-obsessed. Is this Mindfulness movement appealing to a "Me" generation that amounts to a selfish and egotistical approach to the Dharma? Indeed, is it the Dharma stripped of Dharma?

As much as Thich Nhat Hanh is himself an authentic teacher and a man of the way.

Gassho
Myozan

[Hans]

Hello Myozan,

my guess is that he isn't writing his own texts all of the time and that he trusts his senior students to run most of the day to day teachings.

Who it is that should forgive a non-ultimately existent self is a funny avenue for further enquiry.

The thing is that so many people have massive issues with themselves, so much that it might actually make sense to some teachers to "repair" and strenghten their egos, before they are ready to actually start with the real dharma part.

You need a healthy and balanced sense of self, before you can safely proceed to demolish the self-floor we are basing our lives on.


Gassho,

Hans Chudo Mongen

[Tiwala]

Hi,

What page is this from? I wanna see it for myself

Gassho,
Ben

[Ryumon]

I've always felt that his approach was infused with a certain flavor of motivational stuff like that. I bet many of his books back in the day, and a lot of them came through as sugarcoated.


(Posted from my iPhone; please excuse any typos or brevity.)

[Kyonin]

Hi,

Yes, I think the mindfulness movement is all about feeling good for you and yourself only. I have almost never found any reference to charity or compassion on the mindfulness material I have read.

Master TNH is great, but I do agree. His quotes are posted by others and almost always out of context, resulting in selfish messages.

But I could be wrong, of course.

Gassho,

Kyonin

[Tiwala]

Hi,
I don't personally like his style, but he's produced Cheri Maples, who seems like a cool teacher. Very sober, realistic, honest. I guess it works for some people. The world is full of different styles and none of them are perfect.

I have nothing but respect for the man, though. I mean he's been through a lot and to think he managed to keep a sane mind despite all that is pretty laudable.

Gassho,
Ben

[Hans]

Hello,

just a little reminder to point to the fact that a little "Hi" or "Hello" at the beginning of a post and a quick but heartfelt "Gassho" or "Kind regards" at the end of a post can go a long way towards creating and maintaining a good respectful mood, since we are not a Buddhist discussion forum, but a real Sangha where discussions can happen too.

Gassho,

Hans Chudo Mongen

[Myoku]

Hello Myozan and fellow leafers,
I dont know this posts first hand. To be honest, I think they are helpful. If someone asked me at the beginning of my "zen life" if i'ld like to leave myself behind and live for others I would have turned right away. People struggle with life, thats why they seek for relief. If you offer something to comfort them, you can pick them up right where they are. Moreover, there are many many people (sometimes including me) which are hardest to themselve. To open for the teaching you need to open yourself to yourself, be kind and gentle to yourself. To sum up, what Myozan is quoting might not be the full teaching, but loving oneself is very helpful (again the right amount is what makes all the difference). All my much biased view
Gassho
Myoku

[Mp]

Hello everyone,

I too have seen this kind of "mass quoting" on Facebook and I truly wonder the authenticity of the message(s). I believe it is very important to help and support everyone in the best ways we can, but we cannot forget to care for ourselves.

Gassho
Shingen

[Bunny]

Thank you Hans for the reminder on posting etiquette. It does go a long way-I see that now that it's been pointed out. I will make a greater effort to be aware of what I do with words in our forum.
Gassho
Bunny

[Heion]

Interesting topic,
At least this is better than the official 'Buddhism' page! They post pictures of bodhisattva and of buddhas asking for likes in their honor. As Hans said, I believe this is what is going on at this page. I remember listening to a teaching by Sylvia Boorstein and saying that the people who need to most compassion sometimes are ourselves, since we can be so self disparaging.

Gassho,
Alex

[Heisoku]

Hi, yes Alex this is an interesting topic.
My thoughts are that this 'positive self-reflective' mindfulness seems to generate a tension with actually realising Buddhadharma for yourself. My observations are that the medium of Twitter and Facebook naturally generate soundbite-like quotes, which diminish any observation an/or realisation and create the impression of dumbing-down or commercialisation. The habit then is for others to sustain this model of expression.
Just a reminder from the ParaNirvana Sutra: one of the 8 awakenings described by Buddha before he parted was,' Not to neglect mindfulness'. Perhaps we are not neglecting mindfulness, but taking it out of context with the other 7? Which are; have few desires, know how much is enough, enjoy serenity, make diligent effort, (not to neglect mindfulness), practice meditation, cultivate wisdom and not to engage in hollow discussions. Dogen discusses this in Shobogenzo Fascicle 84, The 8 awakenings.
Enjoy your serenity!
Gassho.

[Jinyo]

Hi there,

there are several feeds/links for TNH on facebook - would it be possible to say which one you are referring to Myozan?

The two pages I looked at seemed fine to me. One was 'gems' - motivational quotes I guess. I don't think this does any harm - and we don't know whether someone might not think about a quick quote in more depth. The other page was links to teachings/recordings/events.

I think Thich Nhat Hanh's teachings and the Mindfulness movement in general speaks to the part of us that is messed up. I feel this is no bad thing. Let's be honest - we all feel anger, shame, insecurity, sadness, etc. etc. and need to work on our emotions. It isn't selfish to give time to sorting ourselves/ our 'self' out. It's actually wise.

TNH continually refers to the metaphor of using garbage to make beautiful flowers. His teachings can come across as sugarcoated and simplistic and lend themselves to being used as soundbites - but for many people that's not a bad starting place. IMHO starting someplace simple - taking a small step - isn't necessarily dumbing down or influencing people to be more egotistical. If Hahn's followers absorb a mere shred of their teacher's manifest equanimity the world must be a better place for it.

Gassho

Willow

[Joyo]

Interesting topic,
At least this is better than the official 'Buddhism' page! They post pictures of bodhisattva and of buddhas asking for likes in their honor. As Hans said, I believe this is what is going on at this page. I remember listening to a teaching by Sylvia Boorstein and saying that the people who need to most compassion sometimes are ourselves, since we can be so self disparaging.

Gassho,
Alex

Yes, Alex, I completely agree with you. We can most definitely be our own worst critics.

Gassho,
Treena

[Jundo]

Hi,

I cannot find the link to this page, can you point it out?

But I want to offer a bit of caution here, as a Precept we will reflect on in a few weeks guides "To Refrain from Discussing Faults of Others". Nishijima Roshi says ...

This is a precept pointing out that we should not be too critical or self-righteous when our Buddhist brothers and sisters, struggling as best they can to engage in Buddhist practice through the activities of their daily lives, stumble or fall off the path.

On the other hand, as we saw on another thread today on Bankei, Zen Teachers like Hakuin, Dogen (even Nishijima Roshi very often) could be quite strong in their language when pointing out to their own students perceived weaknesses in the Buddhist Practice of others ...

http://www.treeleaf.org/forums/showthread.php?11525-Bankei&p=113239&viewfull=1#post113239

A bit of a Koan there. I suppose it depends whether one is speaking so in order to Teach one's own students rather than to denigrate someone when speaking to them, and whether one is trying to stick to constructive criticism while keepiing constantly in mind one's own weaknesses.

In this case, as Myozan pointed out and whatever a few quotes indicate, Thich Nhat Hanh is a venerated and powerful Teacher of gentleness (with iron strength) and Compassion. A few quotes, possibly spurious or taken out of context, are not to be judged.

It is true that Buddhism has always been centered on Transcending the little self, like a dream. It is also true that Mahayana Buddhists daily vow to "Save All Sentient Beings". We also have a way of seeing through time.

Yet, simultaneously, Masters have taught that you (though not really "there" in one way) are also a precious jewel, the unique and only "you" in the whole universe, precisely perfectly you "youing" in this very moment. You are so and, in fact, every person, tree, grain of sand or mountain in all the cosmos is so ... each a Diamond in Indra's Net. Masters have also taught that, in order to have the energy and Wisdom to help others, one must also help oneself too ... thus we first offer Metta Chant to our own self before continuing on to others. So it is not really wrong to "Make Time For Yourself; You Are Important" and "Forgive Yourself" too.

As Hans, Willow and others point out, someone with issues of excess self-reproach or excessively weak self worth may benefit from such a reminder. In fact, they and you and all our friends and enemies too ... as is each flower ... are each one precious center of the vast universe.

We sit with our self, and should lose our self and find our Self ... all to make our selfless-self strong ...

... all to work to help our other self ... the others that are this Self too.

Now, on the other hand ... I VERY MUCH AGREE that Buddhism in the West is often turned into a "feel good, Oprah-ized, what's in it for ME ME ME?" commodity. The profound Teachings of Buddha on non-self, impermanence, Dukkha and its causes, the Precepts and all the rest are sometimes lost, and Buddhism becomes a cheap and selfish "self-help" technique or entertainment. I am not the only Zen or Buddhist guy noticing this phenomenon with sadness. Here is a recent article from Tricycle on this very point.

Who's Zoomin' Who? The Commodification of Buddhism in the American Marketplace

http://www.tricycle.com/feature/whos-zoomin-who-commodification-buddhism-american-marketplace

Gassho, J