Practice vs enlightenment-practice

[Houzan]

Hi all,

Few days back I commented on a post where I played around with an analogy (swimming pool), an exercise that gave me a new perspective on practice-enlightenment. Im not fully sure whether this perspective makes fully sense though, so I ask for your help. It seems a bit extreme, but maybe it needs to be. I can’t see where I’m wrong, yet…

We have practice and we have enlightenment-practice (the old switcharoo to make the point more clearly get through). What is the difference?

In practice we observe the traditional forms. This goes from bowing to lending a hand. It may look like practice but it really is not. It is the ego trying to get enlightened, to feel good.

Then there is enlightenment-practice. You let your zazen mind (last couple of days I like to think of it as the “the wind tunnel mind” where the air can flow through freely without obstructions) bleed from pillow to play. It is not limited by traditional forms, although we may execute these as we need to take some forms. Why not these? Why not honor the tradition? They are a beautiful art form. But the essence of enlightenment-practice is not forms. It is the zazen mind. Thus you can sit while lying down. You can bow to a stone, dance to the air, cook dinner and even watch a movie. As long as you enlightenment-practice. This requires constant effort, but not the effort of practice, but the effortless effort of enlightenment-practice.

We therefore have a wrong way to practice and a right way to practice. Helping someone (a form) is great and always have tremendous value, but not necessarily “real practice”. For it to be “real practice”, the help must be delivered with a wind tunnel mind. We act responsively and compassionately to what blows through when needed.

The term “sudden enlightenment” I can now see referring to the split second of difference between practice and practice-enlightenment. “A hair’s breadth deviation, and heaven and earth are set apart.”

It feels correct but I might be missing it completely. Your guidance is most welcome.

Gassho, Hōzan
Satlah

[Bion]

Practice-enlightenment (shushō ittō) means just that practice and realization, or the fulfillment of the practice are one, inseparable. Whether it is on the cushion, or off the cushion, enlightenment is in the doing, in the actualizing, not separate from it. Zazen, forms, rituals, cooking, chopping wood, carrying water, acting compassionately in accordance with the precepts, they are all practice-enlightenment when we awaken to the reality of that and approach them with that same mind. What good would enlightenment be for if it were not expressed in mundane activities, where our lives unfold? Practice-enlightenment is not limited to the cushion and the standing still... Practicing the Dharma is actualizing Enlightenment instantaneously within the entirety of our lives.

Gassho
sat lah

[Houzan]

Practice-enlightenment (shushō ittō) means just that practice and realization, or the fulfillment of the practice are one, inseparable. Whether it is on the cushion, or off the cushion, enlightenment is in the doing, in the actualizing, not separate from it. Zazen, forms, rituals, cooking, chopping wood, carrying water, acting compassionately in accordance with the precepts, they are all practice-enlightenment when we awaken to the reality of that and approach them with that same mind. What good would enlightenment be for if it were not expressed in mundane activities, where our lives unfold? Practice-enlightenment is not limited to the cushion and the standing still... Practicing the Dharma is actualizing Enlightenment instantaneously within the entirety of our lives.

Gassho
sat lah

Beautiful! You say it well. I see this as the same I’m writing (only my post is poorly written). Please help me if it’s not .

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

[Bion]

Beautiful! You say it well. I see this as the same I’m writing (only my post is poorly written). Please help me if it’s not .

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

I don't quite understand your separation between practice and practice-enlightenment. Observing the traditional forms, which you mention, is merely pouring oneself into an action, with no judgment, with equanimity. It does not need to be gain motivated and it may as well be less of en expression of an ego-driven activity that other things, since one does not decide based on preference how to do something, or whether it is worth doing or not. Even for master Dogen, the spiritual path has four elements: aspiration (to enlightenment), practice, enlightenment and nirvana. He himself says that "Between aspiration, practice, enlightenment, and nirvana, there is not a moment’s gap." So, an aspiration for enlightenment is necessary, and not excluded from what drives one to take on practice. In a different place, master Dogen mentions that aspiration again, saying "Those of you who have pure aspiration for enlightenment and want to study buddha-dharma for the sake of buddhadharma should clarify causation as past sages did. Those who reject this teaching are outside the way."
My feeling here is that you want to divide one type of practice from another, as one being complete and the other incomplete, or one superior and the other inferior.
I am sure Jundo or one of our other teachers can and will tackle this better, though.

Gassho
sat lah

[WhiteLotus]

clarify causation

Greetings Bion!

What does he mean by clarify causation?

[Bion]

Greetings Bion!

What does he mean by clarify causation?

Oh, in that section, he speaks of studying and understanding cause and effect, as taught by the Buddha and as the foundation for practice of the way.

Gassho
sat lah

[WhiteLotus]

Oh, in that section, he speaks of studying and understanding cause and effect, as taught by the Buddha and as the foundation for practice of the way.

Gassho
sat lah

What sort of understanding is taught?

[Bion]

What sort of understanding is taught?

You know, conditioned arising. Everything is a product of causes, all conditioned things are impermanent, clinging to conditioned things leads to suffering, this existing leads to that existing, this ceasing leads to the cessation of that.. etc. Of course, understanding this truly, is a fundamental shift for anyone and not an easy task.

Gassho
sat lah

[Houzan]

I don't quite understand your separation between practice and practice-enlightenment. Observing the traditional forms, which you mention, is merely pouring oneself into an action, with no judgment, with equanimity. It does not need to be gain motivated and it may as well be less of en expression of an ego-driven activity that other things, since one does not decide based on preference how to do something, or whether it is worth doing or not. Even for master Dogen, the spiritual path has four elements: aspiration (to enlightenment), practice, enlightenment and nirvana. He himself says that "Between aspiration, practice, enlightenment, and nirvana, there is not a moment’s gap." So, an aspiration for enlightenment is necessary, and not excluded from what drives one to take on practice. In a different place, master Dogen mentions that aspiration again, saying "Those of you who have pure aspiration for enlightenment and want to study buddha-dharma for the sake of buddhadharma should clarify causation as past sages did. Those who reject this teaching are outside the way."
My feeling here is that you want to divide one type of practice from another, as one being complete and the other incomplete, or one superior and the other inferior.
I am sure Jundo or one of our other teachers can and will tackle this better, though.

Gassho
sat lah

Thank you, Bion. I get what your saying. I wanted to add this line to the initial post, but left it out: If you get stuck on right practice during practice, your practice is wrong practice. Point being that there is no inferior or superior practice, there is only one way to practice, and that is to let it all (also any form) actualize/enlighten itself - blow through the tunnel. So maybe my new perspective was simply to understand practice :P

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

[WhiteLotus]

You know, conditioned arising. Everything is a product of causes, all conditioned things are impermanent, clinging to conditioned things leads to suffering, this existing leads to that existing, this ceasing leads to the cessation of that.. etc. Of course, understanding this truly, is a fundamental shift for anyone and not an easy task.

Gassho
sat lah

Thank you for taking the time to clarify what you mean Bion. My perspective may be more simplistic than that though.


Much love,
Salem
satlah

[Shinshi]

Bion has already done a great job of teaching on this topic. In my naive way I see it like this. Once you start talking about practice vs practice-enlightement you have wondered a bit off track. You are already discriminating. To me their is just practice. It is complete and whole in and of itself. Once you start to evaluate your practice you have stepped off the path.

There is just practice. Practice is the way. You can't improve practice, you can't do it right. There is only practice as you can right here right now.

Probably not helpful but that is how I see it today.

Gassho,

Shinshi

[WhiteLotus]

Bion has already done a great job of teaching on this topic. In my naive way I see it like this. Once you start talking about practice vs practice-enlightement you have wondered a bit off track. You are already discriminating. To me their is just practice. It is complete and whole in and of itself. Once you start to evaluate your practice you have stepped off the path.

There is just practice. Practice is the way. You can't improve practice, you can't do it right. There is only practice as you can right here right now.

Probably not helpful but that is how I see it today.

Gassho,

Shinshi

Greetings Shinshi!


I love how you said that! I find that the term practice is a silly word, as it has two very different connotations. One being what you do when you practice a sport or performance art, and the other what doctors do.

Thank you for sharing your insights!

Much love,
Salem
sala

[Bion]

Thank you, Bion. I get what your saying. I wanted to add this line to the initial post, but left it out: If you get stuck on right practice during practice, your practice is wrong practice. Point being that there is no inferior or superior practice, there is only one way to practice, and that is to let it all (also any form) actualize/enlighten itself - blow through the tunnel. So maybe my new perspective was simply to understand practice :P

Gassho, Hōzan
satlah

In every moment one should check whether one's practice is correct, whether it is moved by right intention, right understanding, right thought etc, I believe. Master Dogen travelled across the seas to find true practice and once he found it, then spent a lifetime writing down what it means and what it looks like, cause it was living itself. Mindfulness doesn't maintain itself, the precepts don't keep themselves, the vows require we continuously pay attention and figure out the appropriate response to situations that challenge our ability to keep them etc...
Dogen Zenji offers a quite defined way of sitting zazen, as well as clear guidelines for activities in the monastic community, which include details of what and how to eat, and what and how to wear. He presents that as essential aspects of the life of the awakened ones. Tanahashi Sensei says "Dogen constantly talks about true dharma, genuine teaching, correct lineage, and correct ways. He often uses the word zheng in Chinese or sho in Japanese many times in one sentence. This is the word that means “genuine,” “true,” or “correct.” Establishing authenticity in understanding and in the daily activities of a monastic community was one of Dogen’s primary concerns as a thinker and teacher."
However I feel you might use the word practice to refer only to zazen. Or am I misunderstanding that?

Gassho
sat lah

[Shui_Di]

We have practice and we have enlightenment-practice (the old switcharoo to make the point more clearly get through). What is the difference?

In practice we observe the traditional forms. This goes from bowing to lending a hand. It may look like practice but it really is not. It is the ego trying to get enlightened, to feel good.

Then there is enlightenment-practice. You let your zazen mind (last couple of days I like to think of it as the “the wind tunnel mind” where the air can flow through freely without obstructions) bleed from pillow to play. It is not limited by traditional forms, although we may execute these as we need to take some forms. Why not these? Why not honor the tradition? They are a beautiful art form. But the essence of enlightenment-practice is not forms. It is the zazen mind. Thus you can sit while lying down. You can bow to a stone, dance to the air, cook dinner and even watch a movie. As long as you enlightenment-practice. This requires constant effort, but not the effort of practice, but the effortless effort of enlightenment-practice.

Hi Houzan,

Let me give my little opinion on this.

Maybe you do mean that Practice is kinda formal procedure, and practice-enlightement is the Zazen mind.

Actually, in my opinion, Practice is not only sit straight, bowing or etc. Sit Straight and bowing without "Zazen mind" is not practice.

And Practice-enlightement is not only about "Zazen mind", but also including Zazen speech and Zazen action, in any thing, like keeping the precept, doing daily life, helping others, and of course including bowing and sit straight.

We do practice not to get any result of it. It is because just the practice of Buddhas.

Gassho, Mujo
Stlah

[Houzan]

In every moment one should check whether one's practice is correct, whether it is moved by right intention, right understanding, right thought etc, I believe. Master Dogen travelled across the seas to find true practice and once he found it, then spent a lifetime writing down what it means and what it looks like, cause it was living itself. Mindfulness doesn't maintain itself, the precepts don't keep themselves, the vows require we continuously pay attention and figure out the appropriate response to situations that challenge our ability to keep them etc...
Dogen Zenji offers a quite defined way of sitting zazen, as well as clear guidelines for activities in the monastic community, which include details of what and how to eat, and what and how to wear. He presents that as essential aspects of the life of the awakened ones. Tanahashi Sensei says "Dogen constantly talks about true dharma, genuine teaching, correct lineage, and correct ways. He often uses the word zheng in Chinese or sho in Japanese many times in one sentence. This is the word that means “genuine,” “true,” or “correct.” Establishing authenticity in understanding and in the daily activities of a monastic community was one of Dogen’s primary concerns as a thinker and teacher."
However I feel you might use the word practice to refer only to zazen. Or am I misunderstanding that?

Gassho
sat lah

If I try to continuously check my practice against the noble eightfold path, or any other standard, my mind will make a huge effort and judge my practice (maybe its not so for others!). Thus it will be "wrong practice". Some Theravada paths, as well as some Rinzai paths, I feel, try so hard to be mindful or to solve koans. Trying to act according to a standard. But this is not how I see Dogen's style. Its funny that he was the king of standards when Rujing, his "Old Buddha", said: "Studying Zen is dropping off body and mind. It is not necessary to burn incense, make prostrations, recite the name of the Buddha, practice confession, or read sutras. Just sit, and attain the way." The only way I can understand this apparent conflict is that Dogen used standards as a teaching tool. I imagine him saying: "Follow these standards, but follow them in the right way! Right means to not grasp at these standards, but to let them go WHILE following them". I believe that it is this he referred to when he used the word "genuine/true/correct". In other words, to let the standards/forms actualize/enlighten themselves without the us adding something to them (e.g., "this is the right thing to do"). I always liked Bodhidharma's One-Mind precepts: that right behaviors arises naturally from realizing emptiness. This is in line with what Rujing said. The essence is not forms, but the zazen mind (on AND off the cushion). With zazen mind, all forms become "right" and right behaviors arises naturally.

Gassho, Hozan
Satlah